Post Fanime 2010 Weapons? Props? Peacebonding? Policy? Ask those ? here...

[Infernal Shotgun]

Okay, this is a BIT off topic, but you know what they say: "It's better to post in an old thread than make a new one."

What are the rules about shovels? They obviously aren't MADE to be used as weapons, but I'm worried that they might fall under the Live Steel clause.

[BSaphire]

Okay, this is a BIT off topic, but you know what they say: "It's better to post in an old thread than make a new one."

What are the rules about shovels? They obviously aren't MADE to be used as weapons, but I'm worried that they might fall under the Live Steel clause.

Thank your for posting your question. Someone from Rovers will answer this in the near future.

btw... your post made me laugh I thought of all the murder mystery movies I have watched where the shovel was used to bop someone to either get away or stop them in their tracks... kind of like the "a frying pan is for cooking, but it got used to knock someone out." Anything can be used as a weapon with the right technique. Have you ever seen a piece of straw in the middle of a pane of glass and the glass is unbroken? Some things are just amazing to me *LOL ^^)

BSaphire

[Jerry]

Okay, this is a BIT off topic, but you know what they say: "It's better to post in an old thread than make a new one."

What are the rules about shovels? They obviously aren't MADE to be used as weapons, but I'm worried that they might fall under the Live Steel clause.

you may want to describe the cosplay that your doing and give us an idea how large the shovel is. that and/or really ask yourself is the shovel REALLY needed to get the idea of the character accross?

the unfortunate side effect is that by definition- it is considered "live steel" because most shovels have pointed ends used for digging. it definitely has very negative potential for doing some damage-> Liability storm....

even if we allowed the shovel--- how you hold the shovel will also be an issue. for safety reasons it should never be raised above torso level [AKA high sticking like in hockey], and Definiately NOT above shoulder levels even in for posted pictures. That and shovels get pretty heavy if your trying to carry it all over the con with you.

My guess [until further ruled by other Rover heads] would be likely be " NO " - so an alternative would be getting a large Toy shovel? You get the idea accross and maybe bonus humor points for carrying a toy shovel instead of a real shovel.


again we're not trying to turn down everything props/weapons wise--- theres a fine line between authenticity and making " the average pedestrian " feel comfortable around you. i mean would you feel comfortable with a random costumed person running around with an industrial shovel on his back? 

[BSaphire]

i mean would you feel comfortable with a random costumed person running around with an industrial shovel on his back?  

*LOL ... Thanks Jerry More visual images of coplayers with shovels go rushing through my head... *sees Jesus with a shovel in one hand and a "Turn to Jesus or Burn in HELL!" sign in the other*....

~ After thought ~ *LOL That would be an interesting marketing tool (No pun intended ) for Jesus! He would show you the way... one way or the other *LOLTMSH*

[Rodney_Pheonix]

Very simple to make a cardboard shovel blade that looks like the real thing. If you have to you could paint the cardboard shovel blade CalTrans orange.....wait.. they'd mistake you for stealing it from a work project....

[chaosbark]

Sorry wrong thread!

[Infernal Shotgun]

My guess [until further ruled by other Rover heads] would be likely be " NO " - so an alternative would be getting a large Toy shovel? You get the idea accross and maybe bonus humor points for carrying a toy shovel instead of a real shovel.

Very simple to make a cardboard shovel blade that looks like the real thing. If you have to you could paint the cardboard shovel blade CalTrans orange.....wait.. they'd mistake you for stealing it from a work project....

Hmmm. These ideas seem promising. Thanks for the help, guys! My current plan is to go as a gravedigger, so the shovel is almost a requirement.

[Nina Star 9]

If I have a prop gun that more closely resembles a hairdryer than a real gun (very cartoony in shape!) and is painted bright blue, do I still need an orange tip?

Reference pic, since I don't have the prop made yet


I doubt anyone is going to confuse that thing for a real gun, but I'd rather be safe and do an orange tip if I had to.



Thanks!

[Jerry]

I forgot about the rules about gun types props... 

Hopefully Steve [or others] could clarify, but because of its cartoony style it doesnt look like a replica gun.

i think we've been okay with Nerf type weapons because their usually large- and specifically designed not to look like real gun. [however the nerf type should NOT be loaded for obvious safety reason]--- now come to think of it we may have banned weapons that have the capability to projectile anything [including water guns] so I may have just contradicted myself >_<

The issue now is because of its smaller size and slightly has the 'gun' shape. but if you keep the obvious cone shape from its design i would like think it would be allowable.

again i could be completely wrong. I need another opinion is in order.

[Mach5Motorsport]

Okay, this is a BIT off topic, but you know what they say: "It's better to post in an old thread than make a new one."

What are the rules about shovels? They obviously aren't MADE to be used as weapons, but I'm worried that they might fall under the Live Steel clause.

Um, don't bring real tools like a shovel to the con.  Objects made of metal are a danger regardless their purpose.

[OGIGA]

Very simple to make a cardboard shovel blade that looks like the real thing. If you have to you could paint the cardboard shovel blade CalTrans orange.....wait.. they'd mistake you for stealing it from a work project....

It's going to get banned for looking real. 

[HelloDolly]

Shovels.

I actually just asked this but emailed the staff directly. I was told that plastic is okay but metal is absolutely not. I doubt I'll be able to find a plastic military entrenching tool (in the style that looks like Soldier's from TF2) but if you happen to find a good plastic one, send the link my way!

[Rodney_Pheonix]

Shovels.

I actually just asked this but emailed the staff directly. I was told that plastic is okay but metal is absolutely not. I doubt I'll be able to find a plastic military entrenching tool (in the style that looks like Soldier's from TF2) but if you happen to find a good plastic one, send the link my way!

Ooh, that'd actually be rather easy to make with PVC and Cardboard, and make it look like you pulled it from the game world.

[billgoku]

I have a slight question to be answered if possible. Last year I went as Ichigo, and yes he has a sword but he does not use a sheath of any kind. Now, last year, when I checked it in they made me bond it to my sash, which was very uncomfortable. Keep in mind, my word has no metal what so ever, and the one I did have was rather weak so if I had hit someone, it would of broke in two. lol Now, 10 minutes after I had done this, I ran into 4 other Ichigo's who had already been to the same place for their bonding. All they were asked of was a tie wrap around the hilt of their sword, not to their costume. I took their advice and removed it from my sash, left the piece bonding on it. That day, and the next day rover staff stopped me, checked it, said it was fine, no problems since the 3 tie wraps were visible, no problems at the gathering either.

My point is, why did one person have it done, but half a dozen others didn't? The bonding to said costume that is. Their swords weren't at all that different than mine honestly so I didn't see a reason for me being treated differently than others. Sorry for the long winded post, want to clarify this.

[Rodney_Pheonix]

Could very well have been a different person that did the peacebonding.

[Jerry]

Could very well have been a different person that did the peacebonding.

that might have been the case in point---
we do our best to train/ practice with our staff [Rovers peace bonding and weapons check staff] to make sure they stay consistent with the rules and guidelines that follow both SJPD codes as well as the safety conducts of the SJCC ---

unfortunately we do admit that sometimes some cosplayers / weapons may go un checked or get peace bonded when they may or may NOT be "allowable" weapons / prop per conditions.

WE apologize for any confusion and/or misgiving you may have.

as a REMINDER - you have to right to make sure the person peace bonding you or weapon/prop checking you IS AN ACTUAL ROVER with PROPER FANIME 2010 PEACE BOND TIES [yes they ACTUALLY SAY Fanime 2010 on them]

we had some issue with people posing as ROVERs staff and/or using their own colored peace bonds to claim as their weapon/prop as "checked" when it officially was not.

again its the honor and safety for yourself and those around you. so we try our best to keep the rules enforced evenly though its tough to get to thousands of cosplayers all around SJCC as well as around the entire downtown area.

if you have any major concerns or issues, dont hesitate to contact via our staff email.

Thanks!

[Relsek]

Last year was my first year to Fanime, but from what I've seen so far Rovers should be better trained in what the weapon check rules are and/or how to use common sense. 4 of my friends and I cosplayed as Prince of Tennis characters and were walking around carrying tennis rackets a lot of the time but got stopped by a Rover near the Video rooms who said we would either have to put them back in our bags or get them peace bonded. This makes no sense to me as a tennis racket is obviously not a weapon, whether it has a yellow zip tie around it or not. I'm all for having anything that could remotely be considered a weapon checked, but this was kind of ridiculous.

[Jerry]

Last year was my first year to Fanime, but from what I've seen so far Rovers should be better trained in what the weapon check rules are and/or how to use common sense. 4 of my friends and I cosplayed as Prince of Tennis characters and were walking around carrying tennis rackets a lot of the time but got stopped by a Rover near the Video rooms who said we would either have to put them back in our bags or get them peace bonded. This makes no sense to me as a tennis racket is obviously not a weapon, whether it has a yellow zip tie around it or not. I'm all for having anything that could remotely be considered a weapon checked, but this was kind of ridiculous.

ridiculous or not - its our policy that all items or props are checked out.

yes we know that tennis rackets are not weapons, but in the hands of the irresponsible it can and will do damage.
The reason why we tag any weapon/prop is a pseudo agreement that you are responsible for your item even if someone else takes it and becomes and idiot with it.

You might have common sense, but not everyone else does around you. Even if it was your "first" time at con doesnt mean your exempt from the rules. The rules are there for your safety, and not because we want to give you a hard time.

it literally takes 5 minutes to get a peace bonded tag for your weapon/item/prop.
- if someone gets hurt and because someone thought it would be funny to swing a tennis racket at an unsuspecting crowd.  
That's what were trying to prevent.

[Gwydion]

Anything that can be used to whack someone over the head has just gotta be peacebonded. Not because the staff is trying to be annoying, but because at some point some idiot is gonna whack someone over the head with their prop. Tennis rackets aren't weapons, but they are meant to be swung around. It's gonna hurt when you get hit with one.

It's sort of silly, but unfortunately it's just something to deal with 'cause people can't be trusted to behave. At least it wasn't a skateboard. I had to get that peacebonded at a con and it's not a weapon either, though I bet it would hurt more. ^^

[Charis]

Question, because I remember hearing discussion going multiple ways: will wooden swords with scabbards be required to be peace-tied into the scabbard?  It makes it rather more difficult to pose for photos appropriately in a lot of cases when the weapon is tied in that way, and I remember some inconsistency of response in previous years to the question.

Also, a request that I suspect a lot of cosplayers would appreciate: is it possible for peace-bonding staff to NOT put the zip ties on terribly tightly?  Not loose enough that they can be slipped off -- I completely understand that -- but loosely enough that they don't damage the paint job just by being on.  I've had to redo paint because of peace ties, and had them ding up a prop weapon fairly badly in the course of removing it post-con because there was no room to slip even a scalpel blade under to cut the tie free.

(And on the subject of "silly things to peace-bond": yes, I got my giant manta ray peace bonded last year.  No, Rovers didn't make me.  Just for the record. )