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Enkai

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #20 on: June 03, 2017, 06:42:55 PM »

I understand price being a good reason not to go, but if you don't have the money then you honestly should not attend. Going to the con, complaining about not being able to be in events and other things, and then say "Well I don't have the money" seems like your saying that you want to be able to do everything at the con for free. If you really want to go to the con and have low money then buy the ticket early, it isn't too cheap but it is still cheaper.

More interpreting "not having the money" as "not wanting to spend the money" here in my case...

Depends on why you want to go, and what your situation was at the time.  If the only reason you want a badge is to go shopping, and you don't know for certain that there will be anything in artists' or dealers' that makes the cost worth it?  Fanime isn't the sort of convention that gets lots of exclusives, so $85 (or $60 for a single day badge) just for the chance that you MAY find that thing you really want to buy? Pretty steep.  And in our case, buying badges early was a risky prospect (and honestly, still more than we wanted to spend just to go shopping).

This was my husband and my first year not attending Fanime in years (minus one year where I only attended for a day because of finishing up my degree, I've been attending since 2007).  This had nothing to do with Fanime. I had a baby two weeks before the convention, and for a number of reasons, the full convention was NOT going to happen.   We took a little time walked around outside the con to see what cool costumes were around each day, met up with some friends, but didn't buy a badge.

We wanted to though, or really, buy a single one day badge for my husband to use to wander Artists' Alley.  We may not be have the energy to go to the con, and we weren't going to bring a 2-week-old into the more crowded areas of the con, but we could spare a few hours for one of us to see if there was any cool art.

Not for $60 though.

It'd make enforcement tricker, but I'd really love to see a cheaper "shopper's pass" for attendees who don't care about the events, but want access to Dealers' and Artists'.  I understand that putting on the events costs money, so while steep, I'm less concerned about the overall cost of the badge as whole.  But not everybody is interested in being a 24 hour attendee.

My point is that wanting to attend the con and not wanting to spend the money =/= thinking all the events should be free.  It just means thinking that the cost is too high for the events you do want to to attend.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2017, 07:15:14 PM by Enkai »
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Nina Star 9

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #21 on: June 04, 2017, 08:49:00 AM »

Enkai, I feel like your response is much more sensible about not wanting to pay the prices than OP's. (Congrats on the baby, by the way! :D) Not wanting to spend the money because it isn't personally worth it to you and/or very difficult, but also only going there for shorter periods and to socialize outside or otherwise not expect content without paying the price makes a lot of sense, especially with how expensive 1-day badges were this year. (and really I don't think that "not having/wanting to spend the money" = "wanting it to be free" generally, so I'd guess that the person you are responding to is more reacting to OP's entitled attitude in sweeping terms rather than actually meaning that...but who knows)

A shopper's pass is a great idea, though it would be harder to enforce. If it looks different enough from other passes, it would be easy enough to recognize at checkpoints, though keeping shoppers out of other areas would require extra checkpoints. I suppose the bare minimum would be to have another checkpoint at the entrance to the hallway where the karaoke room is, and have a checkpoint at the gaming room, and to not allow shoppers in after a certain time to prevent them from attending the dance (and/or checking badges again at the dance...don't they do bag checks and such anyway to make sure no one's sneaking in drugs or other dangerous items? I haven't been to a dance in well over 10 years haha), since these are the only areas upstairs in the convention center other than the shopping areas. Though, it would create a longer backup and more lines at these areas, so it would be a tradeoff. Panel rooms, video rooms, and the like are located in different areas and those already checking at the door would be trained to not allow shoppers in.

Really, though, I'm mostly for lowering the cost of a 1-day badge. I'm not sure how much profit these make the con vs. weekend badges, but it seems like at least Monday can be made cheaper if nothing else, since the price was far too high.
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InsaneDavid

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #22 on: June 04, 2017, 11:07:06 AM »

The only issue with a "shoppers pass" is it would essentially allow you to get to the second floor of the convention center.  That means we would need to go back to badge checks at the individual halls, and... NO, OH NO, IN THE NAME OF TEZUKA NO!

Yeah, a con badge is essentially paying to shop if dealer's / artist's is your main push.  But it's also paying to host the convention outright.  For those who live in the Bay Area, and especially in San Jose, you know the already outrageous cost of everything is getting more outrageous by the day.  But Fanime? Only around sixty bucks.

Two of my sisters came out for about half of Sunday this year, their first large scale con.  They had an awesome time.  Seeing that they can get a weekend badge for the same price they paid for Sunday, and enjoying the con as much as they did in that short time, has them already planning to attend all weekend and book housing next year.

I look at it this way.  Let's say $60.  That's a lot of money to a lot of people certainly, hell, it's a lot of money to me.  But in the grand scheme of things what is sixty dollars?  Price of a video game?  Nosebleed seats at a sporting event or concert?  A middle of the road meal in San Jose for two?  What many of us spend over the course of FanimeCon buying coffee and breakfast in the morning?  Heck, parking at our preferred lot (making up for last year when they left it at $7 all weekend) was $10 a day this year x 5 = $50.  Truth be told, the badge cost is the "small money" over the course of the weekend, or any given day really.  $60 really only looks like a lot for the con when you compare the value of early registration vs. day-of single day registration.

Fancy, smooth registration systems that allow you to enjoy the convention rather than wait in line for it?  Facilities staff taking care of fast access security so staff and volunteers can be better used elsewhere?  Those cost money, way more than manually sorting out badges or using volunteers for badge checks.  However the cost of a badge hasn't gone up.

Since I got over myself about being unfairly irritated about the otaku fandom years ago and began attending Fanime in 2012, I've said Fanime is the best value attraction for your money in the South Bay Area.  That includes the area's seasonal institutions as well as other conventions that I dearly love, such as the California Extreme Arcade and Pinball Show (which this year will be my 10th in attendance).
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hikanteki

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #23 on: June 04, 2017, 03:43:48 PM »

I understand price being a good reason not to go, but if you don't have the money then you honestly should not attend. Going to the con, complaining about not being able to be in events and other things, and then say "Well I don't have the money" seems like your saying that you want to be able to do everything at the con for free. If you really want to go to the con and have low money then buy the ticket early, it isn't too cheap but it is still cheaper.
My point is that wanting to attend the con and not wanting to spend the money =/= thinking all the events should be free.  It just means thinking that the cost is too high for the events you do want to to attend.

You bring up a lot of good points. I agree there's a difference between not having the money vs not wanting to spend the money.

I think people are just responding to the Original Poster, who cited not being able to go as many events for free as a reason why he's not going to Fanime anymore.
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hikanteki

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #24 on: June 04, 2017, 04:03:55 PM »

The only issue with a "shoppers pass" is it would essentially allow you to get to the second floor of the convention center.  That means we would need to go back to badge checks at the individual halls, and... NO, OH NO, IN THE NAME OF TEZUKA NO!

Yeah, a con badge is essentially paying to shop if dealer's / artist's is your main push.  But it's also paying to host the convention outright.  For those who live in the Bay Area, and especially in San Jose, you know the already outrageous cost of everything is getting more outrageous by the day.  But Fanime? Only around sixty bucks.

Two of my sisters came out for about half of Sunday this year, their first large scale con.  They had an awesome time.  Seeing that they can get a weekend badge for the same price they paid for Sunday, and enjoying the con as much as they did in that short time, has them already planning to attend all weekend and book housing next year.

I look at it this way.  Let's say $60.  That's a lot of money to a lot of people certainly, hell, it's a lot of money to me.  But in the grand scheme of things what is sixty dollars?  Price of a video game?  Nosebleed seats at a sporting event or concert?  A middle of the road meal in San Jose for two?  What many of us spend over the course of FanimeCon buying coffee and breakfast in the morning?  Heck, parking at our preferred lot (making up for last year when they left it at $7 all weekend) was $10 a day this year x 5 = $50.  Truth be told, the badge cost is the "small money" over the course of the weekend, or any given day really.  $60 really only looks like a lot for the con when you compare the value of early registration vs. day-of single day registration.

Fancy, smooth registration systems that allow you to enjoy the convention rather than wait in line for it?  Facilities staff taking care of fast access security so staff and volunteers can be better used elsewhere?  Those cost money, way more than manually sorting out badges or using volunteers for badge checks.  However the cost of a badge hasn't gone up.

Since I got over myself about being unfairly irritated about the otaku fandom years ago and began attending Fanime in 2012, I've said Fanime is the best value attraction for your money in the South Bay Area.  That includes the area's seasonal institutions as well as other conventions that I dearly love, such as the California Extreme Arcade and Pinball Show (which this year will be my 10th in attendance).

The cost of a badge has gone up, although not really by that much. But I definitely think a weekend pass, even at $85, is a great deal, especially given Fanime is a 4 day convention. (Well, more like  3.5, but most of the time the last day is a .5 at most conventions.)

I still think the single days are overpriced though. The only one that may be worth it is Saturday and that's only if you go for the concert. (Since concert prices are close to $60 anyway.) But for the other days, it seems steep. At most big conventions, even all-genre comic cons, a single day pass isn't $60. I think $35-45 would be more reasonable. The only other convention I know of where a day pass is $60 is...San Diego Comic Con. Nothing is in the same league as SDCC.

A shoppers-only pass in theory would be a good idea, but I don't think it would work for Fanime. I agree that with the placement of the dealers hall relative to other events/rooms, it would mess up the badge checkpoints which is one reason why the con was so good this year.

Sac-Anime has a shopping pass which is only available Sunday (the last day of the con) and costs $20. Full Sunday admission costs $30. But at Sac, the dealer's hall is on the lower level and away from  all the other programming. It's much easier to keep it separate. Maybe a better solution for Fanime would just be to lower the Monday price and promote it as a good day for people who primarily want to go shopping.
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WorldDominationStudios

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #25 on: June 05, 2017, 08:50:27 AM »

To address some of your attempted counterpoints:

1. I just started a new job a few days before the convention, and paychecks go out on Fridays. My choices were to buy the pass on-site or not at all.

2. I've paid for 4-day passes almost every year since I first started attending. This year, I just wanted to pop in, watch the opening ceremonies, take a few pictures of any particularly amazing new cosplays, maybe hand out some business cards, and then head back to work (Memorial Day weekend is a very busy time for pool supply stores and I had to beg my boss to even give me ONE day off). But I couldn't even do that because the Opening Ceremonies were on the upper floor. Your implication that I just want everything for free is unfounded and reveals you to be illiterate, judgmental assholes.

3. Yes, a 42% price increase in 7 years is unreasonable. Like I said, this is not Venezuela.

4. "But in the grand scheme of things what is sixty dollars?" - it's what the price of same-day registration should be for a 4-day pass, like it was only a few years go.

5. Lying bout the history of pass price increases doesn't do any favors for one's credibility, especially when some of us like to keep our old paperwork and can fact-check all of this stuff.

Mod edit: #2
« Last Edit: June 05, 2017, 09:05:58 AM by ewu »
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sysadmin

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #26 on: June 05, 2017, 09:05:55 AM »

You want to tone that down, chief?
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bobcat888

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #27 on: June 05, 2017, 10:29:40 AM »


5. Lying bout the history of pass price increases doesn't do any favors for one's credibility, especially when some of us like to keep our old paperwork and can fact-check all of this stuff.


Post paperwork please. Let's stop messing around and get serious about this matter.

After reading this thread it does seem that a bunch of people are finding the 1 day passes to be unreasonably overpriced. Do the organizers of Fanime read these threads and address the feedback? Maybe if I mention how much I loved the rave this year. :)

ALSO! Has the Henti night getting shut down on Sunday been brought up anywhere yet? What happened with all of that anyway? I have a suggestion for the late night video rooms, where can I post it?
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Abyss1

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #28 on: June 05, 2017, 12:28:18 PM »


5. Lying bout the history of pass price increases doesn't do any favors for one's credibility, especially when some of us like to keep our old paperwork and can fact-check all of this stuff.


 Maybe if I mention how much I loved the rave this year. :)



No such event has ever happened at Fanime...nice reach tho
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Nina Star 9

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #29 on: June 05, 2017, 12:41:09 PM »


5. Lying bout the history of pass price increases doesn't do any favors for one's credibility, especially when some of us like to keep our old paperwork and can fact-check all of this stuff.


 Maybe if I mention how much I loved the rave this year. :)



No such event has ever happened at Fanime...nice reach tho
LOL
Pretty sure they were making a joke about how there seems to be very little in the way of contact with staff on these forums, yet the mods will instantly swoop in and remove the "r-word" from posts.

Unless you are also being sarcastic and I'm falling victim to that "lack of tone over the internet" thing ;]


Also, I saw that post before it was edited. Not sure why I was lumped in when I literally said a few posts above that I disagreed with that point, but clearly OP is just salty for the sake of being salty at this point and not worth my time. :]
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Abyss1

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #30 on: June 05, 2017, 02:33:41 PM »


5. Lying bout the history of pass price increases doesn't do any favors for one's credibility, especially when some of us like to keep our old paperwork and can fact-check all of this stuff.


 Maybe if I mention how much I loved the rave this year. :)



No such event has ever happened at Fanime...nice reach tho
LOL
Pretty sure they were making a joke about how there seems to be very little in the way of contact with staff on these forums, yet the mods will instantly swoop in and remove the "r-word" from posts.

Unless you are also being sarcastic and I'm falling victim to that "lack of tone over the internet" thing ;]


Also, I saw that post before it was edited. Not sure why I was lumped in when I literally said a few posts above that I disagreed with that point, but clearly OP is just salty for the sake of being salty at this point and not worth my time. :]

Not being sarcastic...but being old and experienced...i can say these events have not happened in the bay area since 2005 ish...and never at fanime
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InsaneDavid

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #31 on: June 05, 2017, 04:42:56 PM »

Again, food for thought. But then again, I hated the tap'n go system the SVCC had (I cosplay at cons, don't Judge Garruk), and I have heard murmurs of that system coming for fanimecon. But hey, this is my opinion, and wanted to give some food for thought in this matter.

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cassz

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #32 on: June 07, 2017, 03:10:43 PM »


5. Lying bout the history of pass price increases doesn't do any favors for one's credibility, especially when some of us like to keep our old paperwork and can fact-check all of this stuff.


Post paperwork please. Let's stop messing around and get serious about this matter.


I went through Wayback Machine to find registration prices over the last 10 years: http://imgur.com/a/jpxlh
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Firefury Amahira

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #33 on: June 09, 2017, 01:45:06 PM »

I went through Wayback Machine to find registration prices over the last 10 years: http://imgur.com/a/jpxlh

So, for pre-reg a whopping $15 increase, for pretty much everything else, about $30 increase over ten years. Between inflation and rising costs (I would bet good money that SJCC jacked facilities pricing up for the con after they finished the expansion a couple years back!), that really isn't bad at all. Seems like there is a general consensus that the one-day passes are a bit excessively high, but I imagine that is a somewhat deliberate decision since as others have pointed out, the con center staff checking badges at the access points were generally NOT checking to see if it was a full weekend pass versus a one-day pass. Having the one-day passes priced as high as they are offsets the losses from people cheating the system, while also encouraging people to try and pre-reg when possible. Doing a discounted/shoppers access badge for Mondays sounds like a great idea though- the 'just-wanna-shop' crowd could get in, and a steeply discounted final day would also be a great "first taste of a con" for convention newcomers who haven't gone to a con before but are leery about committing to a full weekend right from the start.

I can't say that I feel particularly moved by the OP's tale of woe and wanting to get in to one of the convention events (that is, the opening ceremonies) for free because they couldn't afford a badge. There was plenty of cosplay photography and mingling going on outside the convention center as always, no badge needed. It's not like the convention's timing is some big secret catching anyone by surprise; people can and usually do plan months in advance for it, including saving up the funding necessary even if it means tossing loose change in a jar for months.

By far, restricting the second floor of the convention center to badged attendees only since 2016 is one of the best ideas Fanime has implemented. It has drastically reduced the crush of the crowds on the upper floor by removing the unpaid ghosts, and certainly helps the safety of paying attendees since you don't get the late night drunks and non-paying creepers roaming the main thoroughfares of the con. If that upsets some people badly enough that they're Leaving and Never EVER Coming Back for Realsies!... well, that's their choice to make.
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Abyss1

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #34 on: June 09, 2017, 03:48:16 PM »

dunno I was pretty disappointed with this years opening ceremonies...
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bobcat888

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #35 on: June 10, 2017, 06:42:57 PM »

Seems like there is a general consensus that the one-day passes are a bit excessively high, but I imagine that is a somewhat deliberate decision since as others have pointed out, the con center staff checking badges at the access points were generally NOT checking to see if it was a full weekend pass versus a one-day pass. Having the one-day passes priced as high as they are offsets the losses from people cheating the system, while also encouraging people to try and pre-reg when possible. Doing a discounted/shoppers access badge for Mondays sounds like a great idea though- the 'just-wanna-shop' crowd could get in, and a steeply discounted final day would also be a great "first taste of a con" for convention newcomers who haven't gone to a con before but are leery about committing to a full weekend right from the start.

Let's not brush off the possibility of a new and better system simply due to the pass checkers not doing their job. If they're volunteers or the hired security staff, they should be mindful of their responsibilities. Especially if they're a volunteer and they're getting a free pass to the con (which is kinda what we're all debating here.. con-accessibility/cost).

By the logic of your post it seems that the dam that's holding off the one day pass is due to the incompetence of the staff.

Also, your last suggestion of the "discounted/shoppers access badge for Mondays" would run you into the same wall of problems. Unless that pass was only sold in person on Monday, what's to stop people from buying that cheaper pass for Monday and using it for the entire duration of the con? Unless it looked significantly different. And if the passes (full weekend VS single day) could look significantly different (or just different enough where lazy staff pass checkers could tell with little effort what passes they're looking at) then why not just offer a variety of different passes and have all of the single day passes be lower & not just have the Monday pass be at a lower price.

If it is the staff then I really don't see an issue in lowering the one day passes. Why aren't they paying attention? After the pre-registration passes are cut off then what would it matter selling a cheaper 1 day pass? Certainly a con-goer intending to attend all "four" days would not spend more buying all four one day passes (which would end up being far more expensive). Also, I would imagine that they'd be much more revenue selling more lower priced single day con passes rather then a few single day passes at the cost they are now. Maybe there should be a special sticker or shape to the full weekend passes, but honestly I think if the staff aren't checking then Fanime is playing themselves. Maybe we should all just buy one day passes from now on if we miss pre-registration and use them for the full weekend since nobody is paying any mind.

ALSO, I would think that Friday or even an earlier day would be a better day for a shopper pass. If all you want to go to Fanime for is to shop... then you would probably want to get in there earlier before a lot of items you might be after sell out.
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InsaneDavid

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #36 on: June 10, 2017, 09:50:03 PM »

Every time I went through a badge check the staffer would look and say "Weekend..." - Dunno where they were being so inconsistent with badge checks but I'd say it was a personnel issue at specific points as it isn't something I encountered.  I also watched facilities staff radio around looking for someone who got up to the second floor unbadged on Monday afternoon, then find and escort him out.  They were taking it very seriously.
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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #37 on: June 11, 2017, 09:41:14 AM »

I think I mentioned it in another thread, but I had a badge check staff stop me because my badge was upside-down and she couldn't recognize what type of badge it was. Not sure which badge check stations people were going to, but in my experience, the badge check staff was very thorough with their checking. I also had the experience of most of the staff actually saying "weekend" out loud when checking my badge.

Besides, I agree with the above poster that just because one person is under the impression that badge check staff isn't doing their job doesn't mean that it's a good reason to dismiss feedback about badges entirely. I'm also not sure how much I buy the argument that one-day badges cost so much because badge check staff aren't actually checking badges. That makes no sense at all to me. There's other reasons, and I'm sure they have little or nothing to do with convention center staff doing their job or not. (As the badge check people are not con staff, but convention center staff.)

I haven't been to SVCC, so I can't speak to the strengths and weaknesses of the badge tap system, but I would like to say that if this is implemented, I would like the upstairs to remain the badges area and the downstairs to remain open, if possible. I know that SVCC badges at the doors, but I think that keeping the upstairs and the actual con-provided content behind a paywall as such but allowing people to check out the con and surroundings by entering the first floor is a good balance between preventing ghosting and allowing freedom.

Honestly I'd rather see the con step up its programming and other incentives to entice people to buy badges than see the con implement more and more draconian measures to keep people who aren't paying out. People who can't afford a badge would still be out of luck on seeing that content, but I have a feeling that most of the ghosters are people who no longer find Fanime content worth paying for when they can go to room parties and see cosplayers for free and spend their money on cons with more or better guests, larger industry presence, more exclusive merchandise, etc. Making sure that there's content that can entice these people to actually buy a badge would go much farther in boosting this con than keeping more non-paying people out would, imo.


Not being sarcastic...but being old and experienced...i can say these events have not happened in the bay area since 2005 ish...and never at fanime
You're taking it too literally.

The joke (at least, from how I'm reading the post) is that because Fanime doesn't have a rave (which is entirely true) and because the mods are very quick to swoop in and remove all mentions of the word from posts, it would be a fast way to get staff attention to a post to make a reference to said non-existent rave. (Why am I going to such lengths to explain someone else's offhand joke? That's the real question.)
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Love Sign Master Spark

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #38 on: June 11, 2017, 01:38:16 PM »

I had this lengthy post typed out then decided I hated most of it before posting.  So here are some pricing numbers from a similar sized con (even at the same location) with little other context:

Duration:3 days
Weekend badge cost: $99
One day admission: $50
Autographs cost extra for all attendees.
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Abyss1

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Re: Why I didn't attend this year... and probably won't in the future
« Reply #39 on: June 12, 2017, 09:53:19 AM »

 my bade was flipepd over half the time...they didnt care lol

Saw the AX with by live streaming this year....Fanime needs to step it up
« Last Edit: June 12, 2017, 03:47:46 PM by Abyss1 »
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