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one (of the many) articles here:

http://www.wgem.com/Global/story.asp?S=13706855

Happy Meal Controversy: Are the Toys Bait for Children?

WGEM) --A California mother is leading a class action lawsuit against McDonalds accusing the restaurant chain of using Happy Meal toys as bait to make children want fast food.

But McDonalds is defending its product and menu saying it offers healthier alternatives to some high calorie foods.

The lawsuit against McDonalds puts forth an interesting question when it comes to any kind of fast food for children. Is it the company's responsibility to make sure children are getting a balanced meal or is it up to the parents?

"He's always rocking in his car seat and going lets go to McDonalds mom, McDonalds!," said Lacie Robinson. Robinson says she deals with her children begging for Happy Meals all the time and sometimes, she gives in.

"We go twice a week maybe three times a week, I think its because of the toys that they get with the Happy Meals," said Robinson.

But lately McDonalds has come under fire from public health officials, parents and lawmakers who are frustrated with the rising childhood obesity rates and weak anti-obesity efforts from restaurant operators.

Dietitan Nancy Hays points out there are healthier options available at McDonalds.

Apple slices to replace the french fries and milk instead of soda.

McDonald's says it's proud of its Happy Meals, and said in a statement it "intends to vigorously defend our brand, our reputation and our food."

Hays says it is also the parents responsibility to model healthy eating habits at home, and at restaurants.

"If mom and dad aren't eating the apples at home as well as the apples at the restaurant then why would the child?,"said Hays.

But even then, Hays eating at McDonald's is a choice.

"No one has to drive them to McDonalds to eat the meal, it is a point of personal responsibility and accountability," said Hays.

--------------------------------------------------

Any thoughts, questions, comments?

Back in my day, when I wanted to go to McD's, my dad would drive me there and go home. He didn't even stop or go through the drive-thru. In retrospect, that was pretty funny. XD

A Classic response by a parent now a days, blaming the corporations for their lack of parenting skills.

Are parents now missing the word 'no' from their vocabulary?  If their kid is whining in the back seat to go to McDonalds, does that mean that, unless they do so, they will be reported to Child Protective Services?

Simply put, take responsibility for raising your kid.  It is not the job of a corporation (or teacher...) to raise your child.  Do not blame the company for making your kid eat the food.  Until that child is able to earn (and spend) their own cash, it is no one's fault but the person who buys the food.

Besides, have these people not heard of auction sites?  There are people who sell the entire set of toys there.  Buy the set, and hand them out as a reward.

Quote from: cutiebunny on February 17, 2011, 12:59:39 PM
Are parents now missing the word 'no' from their vocabulary?  If their kid is whining in the back seat to go to McDonalds, does that mean that, unless they do so, they will be reported to Child Protective Services?

Simply put, take responsibility for raising your kid.  It is not the job of a corporation (or teacher...) to raise your child.  Do not blame the company for making your kid eat the food.  Until that child is able to earn (and spend) their own cash, it is no one's fault but the person who buys the food.

Besides, have these people not heard of auction sites?  There are people who sell the entire set of toys there.  Buy the set, and hand them out as a reward.

That would be to easy and lots of effort. Sad to say there are more people out there who should not be parents who are becoming parents and letting the child raise themselves.

Oh gawd. From what I hear, some parts of my hometown (Santa Clara county) are banned from selling Happy Meals until they reach certain nutritional guidelines (and I'm not sure what they are.) Speaking as someone that practically grew up on McDonalds (like ... at LEAST once a week) and isn't 243824732749832 pounds overweight ... McDonalds isn't FULLY to blame. Let's admit, there are a lot of things on the McDonalds menu that aren't healthy, but they also offer healthy alternations for Happy Meals like apple dippers and milk instead of a cheeseburger and a soda. And the toy? C'mon, you're allowed to buy the toy WITHOUT the meal. You shouldn't hold McDonalds responsible because your child is fat and spoiled. DON'T GIVE INTO YOUR KID, YOU'RE THE ONE THAT MAKES THE DECISIONS, NOT YOU ... until that point in adolescence when they realize they can say no back to their parents :P But anyways, I think it's all a matter of parenting, McDonalds is just another one of those "challenges" in your parenting skills.

Quote from: idontknow on February 24, 2011, 03:14:07 PM
Oh gawd. From what I hear, some parts of my hometown (Santa Clara county) are banned from selling Happy Meals until they reach certain nutritional guidelines (and I'm not sure what they are.) Speaking as someone that practically grew up on McDonalds (like ... at LEAST once a week) and isn't 243824732749832 pounds overweight ... McDonalds isn't FULLY to blame. Let's admit, there are a lot of things on the McDonalds menu that aren't healthy, but they also offer healthy alternations for Happy Meals like apple dippers and milk instead of a cheeseburger and a soda. And the toy? C'mon, you're allowed to buy the toy WITHOUT the meal. You shouldn't hold McDonalds responsible because your child is fat and spoiled. DON'T GIVE INTO YOUR KID, YOU'RE THE ONE THAT MAKES THE DECISIONS, NOT YOU ... until that point in adolescence when they realize they can say no back to their parents :P But anyways, I think it's all a matter of parenting, McDonalds is just another one of those "challenges" in your parenting skills.

Aren't FULLY? You mean, aren't to blame at all. If someone goes into a supermarket and buys bleach... and the person drinks it and dies, is it the supermarkets fault or the person that bought it? If a parent goes to the supermarket, and buys dog food, and feed it to their child for a year... is it the supermarkets fault or is it the parents? OH WOWS LOGIC!

Quote from: PyronIkari on February 24, 2011, 08:06:42 PM

Quote from: idontknow on February 24, 2011, 03:14:07 PM
Oh gawd. From what I hear, some parts of my hometown (Santa Clara county) are banned from selling Happy Meals until they reach certain nutritional guidelines (and I'm not sure what they are.) Speaking as someone that practically grew up on McDonalds (like ... at LEAST once a week) and isn't 243824732749832 pounds overweight ... McDonalds isn't FULLY to blame. Let's admit, there are a lot of things on the McDonalds menu that aren't healthy, but they also offer healthy alternations for Happy Meals like apple dippers and milk instead of a cheeseburger and a soda. And the toy? C'mon, you're allowed to buy the toy WITHOUT the meal. You shouldn't hold McDonalds responsible because your child is fat and spoiled. DON'T GIVE INTO YOUR KID, YOU'RE THE ONE THAT MAKES THE DECISIONS, NOT YOU ... until that point in adolescence when they realize they can say no back to their parents :P But anyways, I think it's all a matter of parenting, McDonalds is just another one of those "challenges" in your parenting skills.

Aren't FULLY? You mean, aren't to blame at all. If someone goes into a supermarket and buys bleach... and the person drinks it and dies, is it the supermarkets fault or the person that bought it? If a parent goes to the supermarket, and buys dog food, and feed it to their child for a year... is it the supermarkets fault or is it the parents? OH WOWS LOGIC!

Mm I can kind of see where you're going with that, but it's kind of different with McDonalds. It's not a company trying to sell us bleach to drink or another company trying to sell us dog food for our kids. McDonald's main target is us and they try to sell us food even knowing that it's bad for your health. Of course, speaking in defense of McDonalds, now they display their nutritional facts and, as I mentioned before, have healthier alternatives and menu items. It's like ... it's not McDonalds fault that parents have bad parenting skills and give into their children's demands. But, it's McDonalds fault for making their food very unhealthy ... which was resolved with the healthy alternatives option. So, yeahh ... in a sense, I agree and disagree with you @_@ haha either way, there is a lot more emphasis on blaming the parents than on the company itself. It's like ... there's lots of "bad" in this world, but it's a matter of whether you choose to give into them or not. In the end, the only thing you can blame is yourself.

K, I don't know how I ended all "philosophical" ... and contradicted myself >_<; hahahahah!

Quote from: idontknow on February 25, 2011, 01:44:37 AMwith that, but it's kind of different with McDonalds. It's not a company trying to sell us bleach to drink or another company trying to sell us dog food for our kids. McDonald's main target is us and they try to sell us food even knowing that it's bad for your health. Of course, speaking in defense of McDonalds, now they display their nutritional facts and, as I mentioned before, have healthier alternatives and menu items. It's like ... it's not McDonalds fault that parents have bad parenting skills and give into their children's demands. But, it's McDonalds fault for making their food very unhealthy ... which was resolved with the healthy alternatives option. So, yeahh ... in a sense, I agree and disagree with you @_@ haha either way, there is a lot more emphasis on blaming the parents than on the company itself. It's like ... there's lots of "bad" in this world, but it's a matter of whether you choose to give into them or not. In the end, the only thing you can blame is yourself.

K, I don't know how I ended all "philosophical" ... and contradicted myself >_<; hahahahah!

Why is it McDonalds duty to make "healthy" food for people when that isn't the point of McDonalds and never has been. Nor is McDonalds doing something so low as to make "unhealthy foods" either. Realistically speaking, you should know absolutely that when you walk into McDonalds, what you're eating isn't going to be full of vitamins and minerals, nor is it going to be helping you lose weight. It's fast food. It's... a HAMBURGER, FRENCH FRIES, and the such like that. If you're that stupid thinking "oh, if I eat a lot of mcdonalds, it won't be unhealthy at all!" You are seriously a moron, and that is no ones fault other than your own. What they make isn't UNHEALTHY though. It's just quick food that fills basic nutrients that your body needs.

Okay again, you're stating that it's the restaurants fault for providing unhealthy food. So... if... I go to the supermaket and buy microwavable food/instant ramen/cookies/and pork rinds... I can blame the super market for selling me these foods if I become unhealthy? If I eat nothing but porkrinds, and microwavable pizzas, it's the super markts fault? McDonalds is not supposed to be a healthy alternative to home cooked meals. it's supposed to be something quick and easy that is used as a meal.  If I go into a place that specializes in fried foods and bacon, i expect to get fried foods and bacon. If I eat there, I cannot say "Oh this place is terrible, there food was so unhealthy!!!! OBVIOUSLY, IT'S FRIED FOODS AND BACON. You're just shifting blame and expecting companies to create things they don't need to. If you eat cake and gain weight, it's your fault for eating the cake. Not the bakers, not the person who sold it to you. It's your fault for eating it. The seller does not have to offer you a healthy alternative. The baker does not need to make the cake non-fat. it's your god damned fault for buying it... eating it... and not thinking that you shouldn't.

It's censorship of foods when you think about it. Ok. Let's say, McDonalds regulated their foods due to gov't. If Happy meals weren't hamburgers, fries, a soda, and a toy. You could ONLY GET THE HEALTHY ALTERNATIVE. It's now, grilled chicken, apples, and milk(PS milk is really fatty and sugary). Now, parents cannot blame mcdonalds right?

WHAT IF I WANT A GOD DAMNED HAMBURGER AND FRIES? Oh I can't get it, because gov't regulations don't allow this. Because parents are so dumb that they have to regulate things, causing intelligent people to be penalized.

Ya agreed but toys in McDs are just to attract the children and they are getting positive result as many children just want to go McDs just because of those toys..Also parents are equally responsible for the same.

Quote from: erik6barnes on March 10, 2011, 04:18:09 AM
Ya agreed but toys in McDs are just to attract the children and they are getting positive result as many children just want to go McDs just because of those toys..Also parents are equally responsible for the same.

Holy crap, spam bot search and autoreplies are getting smarter and smarter.

Quote from: TC_X0_Lt_0X on February 15, 2011, 07:14:36 AM
A Classic response by a parent now a days, blaming the corporations for their lack of parenting skills.

Agreed.

How is a Happy Meal different than a Toy at Toys'R'Us. Just tell the kid "NO." >.>;
Teach yourself and the child self-restraint. -.-;

As for whether it is an incentive/marketing ploy... of course it is.
Perhaps in the beginning it was just a bonus to help distract children while the parents ate and many still probably buy them for that reason. Though I really don't see a problem with the practice itself just the parents. It is an accepted part of McDonalds/Burger King, etc..., Happy Meals and unhealthy food is just part of their image. People can eat unhealthy food and still stay skinny/healthy... it is again that thing called "self-restraint."

As for whether the toy attracts children, perhaps it does but it also attracts adults just as much. And likewise, there are children out there that care more for the meal than the toy. (I was one. I thought the toys were dinky as a kid.) Seriously as a kid, what would you rather have: a cheap plastic barbie or an actual toy?
In fact, I haven't seen commercials advertising the toys for awhile now. Happy Meals yes...

And if we want to pick fights over anything.... why don't we throw those Monopoly games out there?

And to bring everything back to the main point, how is picking these fights over dumb things going to help you properly raise your child so it isn't a spoiled brat that doesn't know the term "NO." ???

It seems most agree that parents need to learn how to raise their own kids, 17 (the majority) voted on that in the poll. PERSONALLY I am AGAINST McDonalds and junky fast food like that, but if someone else wants to raise their kids on that, fine... thats their choice.

If I was not against that kind of food, I would surely let my kids have happy meals (no I have not got kids I am only 20), but only on certain occasions. Certainly not every week, and certainly not every day. I agree with the fact that McDonalds is trying to get a bit healthier by adding apples over fries, I do congratulate them for that move.

However ultimately it is up to the parent what is for lunch (or dinner) not the child. So I stand my ground, parents need to learn how to raise their kids, and not use McDonalds or other fast foods as a "Replacement" for a quick fix healthier choice meal.

I do think that the toys that they include in kids meals entice children to want them. And hey you know when I was younger, I did like that, but my parents (as deranged as they may be) raised me correctly, feeding me healthier foods, but knew I deserved a treat every now and again (When we took family trips is usually when I got happy meals). But I do not think parents should fully deny their children the right to a happy meal ONCE IN A WHILE!

Ehh, I don't see the big deal in regulations like this.  In fact, I think it's a great idea.  Most food at McDonald's is healthy by no standards (I've studied this stuff, and trust me...it's bad & there are a lot more problems than just calories), so why not have them at least make an attempt to be healthier, especially if they're going to target kids?  If the parent isn't doing their job and putting their foot down, there's certainly nothing wrong with putting safeguards in place so the kid doesn't get hurt too much.

Quote from: hikanteki on May 24, 2011, 12:32:06 AM
Ehh, I don't see the big deal in regulations like this.  In fact, I think it's a great idea.  Most food at McDonald's is healthy by no standards (I've studied this stuff, and trust me...it's bad & there are a lot more problems than just calories), so why not have them at least make an attempt to be healthier, especially if they're going to target kids?  If the parent isn't doing their job and putting their foot down, there's certainly nothing wrong with putting safeguards in place so the kid doesn't get hurt too much.

Well put.
And yeah they should attempt to make food healthier. When I use to eat that stuff, I didnt really care about the health standards, then last time I had some fries, I got sick because the food was just much to greasy. It was horrible that people feed that to their child. I never would unless they make the food healthier O.o

Quote from: hikanteki on May 24, 2011, 12:32:06 AM
Ehh, I don't see the big deal in regulations like this.  In fact, I think it's a great idea.  Most food at McDonald's is healthy by no standards (I've studied this stuff, and trust me...it's bad & there are a lot more problems than just calories), so why not have them at least make an attempt to be healthier, especially if they're going to target kids?  If the parent isn't doing their job and putting their foot down, there's certainly nothing wrong with putting safeguards in place so the kid doesn't get hurt too much.

Because now you're restricting people and telling people what they can and cannot eat. If I want to eat something unhealthy, who are you to tell me I cannot go out and buy it and eat it? Two cartoons have done an entire episode based on this very thing. King of the Hill and American Dad both did episodes about trans fat banning. You're basically saying that it's okay for the government to mandate what we can and cannot eat because some people are too stupid to make rational decisions.

Now we get into a real health discussion. You know the human body is made to adapt to things right? If you completely remove "bad things" from someone then the body never learns to adapt to bad things and thusly becomes weaker than someone who "only eats healthy things". It's the same idea of never letting your kid go outside and getting hurt, playing in mud, getting drity, etc. When you prevent the human body from ever experiencing these things, they never build up tolarance or immunity to these things.

Rowan RavenSong he got sick because French fries were too greasy for him". Okay, your generic french fries are not that unhealthy. grease and fat are not that bad for you. In many ways, they're incredibly healthy for you in moderation. But your body has grown to not be able to handle it because you avoid eating it and have done so for a long time.

Here's a fun story. There was a man in SE Asia that lived on nothing but bacon(well pork belly not nec. bacon) and deep fried foods for the majority of his entire life. He was one of the healthiest men in the world and is still alive well into his I think 80s now(I hread this story sometime around 2000). Doctors say he was so healthy because his body learned to process the food well.

Am I saying everyone should do this? Of course not because his body adapted faster than most people would. He also exercizes daily and knows how his body works. But it's proof that just because "something is bad" doesn't mean "it's bad".

People in general need to learn moderation. Unhealthy things are healthy for you in moderation, and only eating healthy food is actually bad for you. So will I give my kid things like mcdonalds and stuff? You're damn right I will, but I won't give it to them every day for every meal. People are so busy trying to sound "better" than other people and have this bull shit holier than thou attitude because "I eat right". Last I checked, I'm completely healthy and my diet is far from what people say is "healthy". Last thing I remember was how true vegans actually deprive their body of a lot of nurishments that the body requires and do harm by not eating fatty things.

Think of it. Milk was made by the human body to nourish its young. It's the natural food created by bodies for their children. Do you realize how much fat and sugar is in milk? Milk and dairy products are some of the fattiest foods out there. Sugar? Fruits and fruit juice are mostly sugar. Fruit juice is just as bad for you as almost anything in terms of sugar content. These are natural things with what some people say are terrible for you.

Quit being god damned hypocrites. If you want to talk about diet and health, actually know what the hell you're talking about before you chime in your stupid ass decision about how "so and so is so unhealthy" and "This is so much better for you".

Fruits are actually not healthy for you if you do not eat them correctly. By correctly I mean time based. Fruits are supposed to be eaten when you have an empty stomach and only an empty stomach? Why? Because if you don't... it sits mixed with food that takes more time to digest. When it does that, it rots in your stomach and isn't fully digested and broken down until way after it ferments. But this is basic diet knowledge and you know that right?

Eating healthy means eating in moderation, "good" and "bad". knowing your body and eating things that your body needs is basics, and sometimes your body needs things that are labeled "bad" but in small amounts.

Quote from: PyronIkari on May 24, 2011, 11:23:57 AM
Because now you're restricting people and telling people what they can and cannot eat. If I want to eat something unhealthy, who are you to tell me I cannot go out and buy it and eat it? Two cartoons have done an entire episode based on this very thing. King of the Hill and American Dad both did episodes about trans fat banning. You're basically saying that it's okay for the government to mandate what we can and cannot eat because some people are too stupid to make rational decisions.

It's not about telling people what they can and cannot eat, it's telling companies what they can and cannot sell.  Big difference.

Quote
Now we get into a real health discussion. You know the human body is made to adapt to things right? If you completely remove "bad things" from someone then the body never learns to adapt to bad things and thusly becomes weaker than someone who "only eats healthy things". It's the same idea of never letting your kid go outside and getting hurt, playing in mud, getting drity, etc. When you prevent the human body from ever experiencing these things, they never build up tolarance or immunity to these things.

It isn't quite the same.  You are correct that the body was made to adapt to trace amounts of dirt, poisons, etc, but just trace amounts.  Nothing to the scale of what's in one happy meal, let alone day after day, week after week, etc.  It's like living in a constantly polluted environment - the body can't adapt to something like that.  After eating nothing but garbage for a week you may not get any immediate reactions but the systems inside your body are breaking down.

Quote
Rowan RavenSong he got sick because French fries were too greasy for him". Okay, your generic french fries are not that unhealthy. grease and fat are not that bad for you. In many ways, they're incredibly healthy for you in moderation. But your body has grown to not be able to handle it because you avoid eating it and have done so for a long time.

It depends on the type of grease and fat.  Some types and cooking methods are better for you than others, but unfortunately deep frying is the worst.  Vegetable oils break apart and become toxic when heated to that high of a temperature.  (Ironically enough, when McDonalds was using lard to deep fry their food it was actually much healthier.  Lard, although not a great food, does not break apart when heated to high temperatures.) Fast food restaurants (and, sadly, most others for that matter) also reuse oil for as long as they can get away with, which means you're getting rancid oils.

Quote
Here's a fun story. There was a man in SE Asia that lived on nothing but bacon(well pork belly not nec. bacon) and deep fried foods for the majority of his entire life. He was one of the healthiest men in the world and is still alive well into his I think 80s now(I hread this story sometime around 2000). Doctors say he was so healthy because his body learned to process the food well.

Am I saying everyone should do this? Of course not because his body adapted faster than most people would. He also exercizes daily and knows how his body works. But it's proof that just because "something is bad" doesn't mean "it's bad".

Do you have any proof of this person?  Although it is believeable in theory, I'll admit.  Also, it is correct that food is only part of the problem and we indeed need to do other things to stay healthy like exercise, such as this man did.

Quote
People in general need to learn moderation. Unhealthy things are healthy for you in moderation, and only eating healthy food is actually bad for you. So will I give my kid things like mcdonalds and stuff? You're damn right I will, but I won't give it to them every day for every meal. People are so busy trying to sound "better" than other people and have this bull shit holier than thou attitude because "I eat right". Last I checked, I'm completely healthy and my diet is far from what people say is "healthy". Last thing I remember was how true vegans actually deprive their body of a lot of nurishments that the body requires and do harm by not eating fatty things.

This doesn't have anything to do with veganism and I am certainly not advocating that nor would I advocate a no-fat or no-carb diet.  You have to eat good fats and good carbs.  But you're absolutely wrong when you say that "only eating healthy food is actually bad for you."

Quote
Think of it. Milk was made by the human body to nourish its young. It's the natural food created by bodies for their children. Do you realize how much fat and sugar is in milk? Milk and dairy products are some of the fattiest foods out there. Sugar? Fruits and fruit juice are mostly sugar. Fruit juice is just as bad for you as almost anything in terms of sugar content. These are natural things with what some people say are terrible for you.

Quit being god damned hypocrites. If you want to talk about diet and health, actually know what the hell you're talking about before you chime in your stupid ass decision about how "so and so is so unhealthy" and "This is so much better for you".

Fruits are actually not healthy for you if you do not eat them correctly. By correctly I mean time based. Fruits are supposed to be eaten when you have an empty stomach and only an empty stomach? Why? Because if you don't... it sits mixed with food that takes more time to digest. When it does that, it rots in your stomach and isn't fully digested and broken down until way after it ferments. But this is basic diet knowledge and you know that right?

Eating healthy means eating in moderation, "good" and "bad". knowing your body and eating things that your body needs is basics, and sometimes your body needs things that are labeled "bad" but in small amounts.

Regarding milk, well, I won't stay that it's the greatest food, but you need to know that one fat and one sugar is NOT as good as another fat or another sugar.  Also, don't compare milk to McD's fast food -- McD's is healthy by NO standards.  Nowhere did I ever say that fruit juice was healthy either; in fact I agree that it's one of the worst things you can drink, especially if it's from concentrate.  You just put a lot of words into my mouth and used them to say that I don't know what I'm talking about.  That was uncalled for.  Trust me -- I know this stuff & yes, I am also very aware that fruits are best when eaten on an empty stomach.  If you want to have an in-depth conversation about nutrition, I'm certainly down for it but you will need to lay off the attitude and personal attacks.

Yeah true, I DID deprive my body of it, same if I eat meat.

About that guy who ate bacon for like all his life, good for him then if he survived. I mean the body adapts to the most extremes.

Still stands the fact  we should not totally ban happy meals, just make them healthier. Adults who eat McDonalds of course should moderate their intake. But hey, not judging there.

Quote from: hikanteki on May 24, 2011, 01:02:59 PM
It's not about telling people what they can and cannot eat, it's telling companies what they can and cannot sell.  Big difference.

Same difference. This is no different than banning anything that is potentially harmful through abuse.

Quote
It isn't quite the same.  You are correct that the body was made to adapt to trace amounts of dirt, poisons, etc, but just trace amounts.  Nothing to the scale of what's in one happy meal, let alone day after day, week after week, etc.  It's like living in a constantly polluted environment - the body can't adapt to something like that.  After eating nothing but garbage for a week you may not get any immediate reactions but the systems inside your body are breaking down.

Now you are speaking of judgment over what is being sold. No different than stating if someone chooses not to eat anything at all for a week. Trace amounts? Oh ho, now you're being subjective. Define trace amounts. If I eat McDonalds once every week, is that trace amounts? Will I DIE IF I EAT McDonalds once a week? What about twice every week? Will my body break down and leave me a useless mess if I eat McDonalds twice a week? I mean, it's poison right? If I eat McDonalds then i'm literally consuming poison that will break down my insides and kill me?

Oh but 2 times a week is still trace amounts. It isn't enough to kill me. K'... I eat McDonalds for 4 meals a week. SURELY THIS IS SO MUCH POISON THAT I AM GOING TO DIE AS IT WILL BREAK DOWN ALL OF MY INSIDES AND MY BODY WILL COMPLETELY ROT AND IT CANNOT STAND THIS HARSH ENVIRONMENT ARRRRRRGH I DIEIDDIDIDIDS!

What a joke. Thousands of people eat fast food for almost every meal they have because it's convenient and fast. It's not healthy, but it is not poisoning them and killing them. You do not see thousands of people dying every day due to McDonalds.

Quote
It depends on the type of grease and fat.  Some types and cooking methods are better for you than others, but unfortunately deep frying is the worst.  Vegetable oils break apart and become toxic when heated to that high of a temperature.  (Ironically enough, when McDonalds was using lard to deep fry their food it was actually much healthier.  Lard, although not a great food, does not break apart when heated to high temperatures.) Fast food restaurants (and, sadly, most others for that matter) also reuse oil for as long as they can get away with, which means you're getting rancid oils.

Okay? And? Do you know what else people eat in the world? Koreans eat fermented cabbage. Finnish eat fermented fish in a barrel. Do you know what alcohol is? That's all poison to though right? Companies should not be allowed to sell alcohol, kim chi, sirgstromi(sp?), lots of different cheeses, and hell... most foreign foods should be banned too in this case.

Quote
People in general need to learn moderation. Unhealthy things are healthy for you in moderation, and only eating healthy food is actually bad for you. So will I give my kid things like mcdonalds and stuff? You're damn right I will, but I won't give it to them every day for every meal. People are so busy trying to sound "better" than other people and have this bull shit holier than thou attitude because "I eat right". Last I checked, I'm completely healthy and my diet is far from what people say is "healthy". Last thing I remember was how true vegans actually deprive their body of a lot of nurishments that the body requires and do harm by not eating fatty things.

This doesn't have anything to do with veganism and I am certainly not advocating that nor would I advocate a no-fat or no-carb diet.  You have to eat good fats and good carbs.  But you're absolutely wrong when you say that "only eating healthy food is actually bad for you."

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Regarding milk, well, I won't stay that it's the greatest food, but you need to know that one fat and one sugar is NOT as good as another fat or another sugar.  Also, don't compare milk to McD's fast food -- McD's is healthy by NO standards.  Nowhere did I ever say that fruit juice was healthy either; in fact I agree that it's one of the worst things you can drink, especially if it's from concentrate.  You just put a lot of words into my mouth and used them to say that I don't know what I'm talking about.  That was uncalled for.  Trust me -- I know this stuff & yes, I am also very aware that fruits are best when eaten on an empty stomach.  If you want to have an in-depth conversation about nutrition, I'm certainly down for it but you will need to lay off the attitude and personal attacks.

See here's the thing. I do not put words in your mouth, I'm merely showing you how YOU ARE PORTRAYING THE INFORMATION. You literally said those things wwhether or not you meant to word it that way. If you omit something then you are stating that it doesn't exist. If you say "eating mcdonalds will kill you" and leave it at that, you are stating that if someone eats mcdonalds they will die. That is not putting words in your mouth, that is literally what you just said, because you do not go into explain the reasonings, the exceptions, the basis of how that statement is true. To make it a true statement you must say "Eating McDonalds constantly without balancing it out with other nutients and lack of exercise will kill you over time". See the difference? You're stating the top and that's it. You did it again in your reply to me by stating how poisonous McDonalds is.

I am perfectly healthy. I eat fast food for the large majority of my meals. Just yesterday I ate a huge serving of beef fat french fries(these things are so damn delicious). I consume quite a lot of alcohol, I smoke, I don't exercise very much... and I am completely healthy. Are you going to say I'm not? My doctor will disagree with you. I kind of trust him more than you. But according to everything you said, I should be a lifeless pile of fat with organs that do not work.

Health, nutrition and what the human body needs VARIES SO MUCH BETWEEN PEOPLE that stating certain blanket statements are complely baseless. The idea of nutrition works on the idea of a control standard of food. Nutritional facts are based on 2000 calorie diets and most people do not live on 2000 calorie diets. If people want to eat McDonalds they can. It won't kill them. It's just not the "healthiest".

And besides that the biggest thing in this is... who gives a damn if it's unhealthy. Not everyone cares about taking perfect care of their health, because I will straight you say right now that you do not. Is this a huge claim? Yes, but it's true, because no one does. No one exercises the perfect amount every day. No one eats their perfect nutritional balance. Everyone indulges in things that are not healthy sometimes. Some days you over sleep, some days you undersleep, but you know what? That is your damn choice to make. If I want to eat a tub of ice cream, I damn well can eat a tub of ice cream. If I want to put a bunch of hot sauce on my food, I can and will. People do not eat just to stay healthy, people eat to enjoy the food they eat. People eat what is convenient, fast, or whatever it is they feel like doing at the time. Or are you against this and saying, people should ban food that is not healthy? Candy stores shouldn't exist, because candy is bad for kids? They shouldn't allow candy to be sold right? Let's ban chocolate, because that stuff is bad for people. ALL DESERT PLACES MUST GO!!!!!!! This is a health liquidation, only healthy things should exist, stores should not be allowed to sell unhealthy stuff. Because we're not taking away your choice to eat it, we're taking away the stores what they can and cannot sell.

Quote from: PyronIkari on May 24, 2011, 01:35:41 PM
Same difference. This is no different than banning anything that is potentially harmful through abuse.

No it's not.  Again, they're not banned, what's going on is it has to do with how things are marketed towards kids.  There's a reason why Joe Camel can't be in kids magazines.

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Now you are speaking of judgment over what is being sold. No different than stating if someone chooses not to eat anything at all for a week. Trace amounts? Oh ho, now you're being subjective. Define trace amounts. If I eat McDonalds once every week, is that trace amounts? Will I DIE IF I EAT McDonalds once a week? What about twice every week? Will my body break down and leave me a useless mess if I eat McDonalds twice a week? I mean, it's poison right? If I eat McDonalds then i'm literally consuming poison that will break down my insides and kill me?

The more you eat things like that the sooner your body will break down.  It will not likely be all at once and it may be as little as 5 days sooner or 5 years sooner, but who knows.

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What a joke. Thousands of people eat fast food for almost every meal they have because it's convenient and fast. It's not healthy, but it is not poisoning them and killing them. You do not see thousands of people dying every day due to McDonalds.

McDonalds is just one factor.  There are many other reasons why people would get sick and die earlier and all of them contribute together, but I think that's something we can agree on.  However, I'm all for any steps in the right direction, no matter how small.

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Okay? And? Do you know what else people eat in the world? Koreans eat fermented cabbage. Finnish eat fermented fish in a barrel. Do you know what alcohol is? That's all poison to though right? Companies should not be allowed to sell alcohol, kim chi, sirgstromi(sp?), lots of different cheeses, and hell... most foreign foods should be banned too in this case.

What does this have to do with fermented cabbage or fish or banning foreign foods?  This shows that you don't know what you're talking about as kimchi, when made properly (like most Korean stores & restaurants actually do) is VERY healthy.  I am not as familiar with Finnish fermented fish so I will not comment on that.

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See here's the thing. I do not put words in your mouth, I'm merely showing you how YOU ARE PORTRAYING THE INFORMATION. You literally said those things wwhether or not you meant to word it that way. If you omit something then you are stating that it doesn't exist. If you say "eating mcdonalds will kill you" and leave it at that, you are stating that if someone eats mcdonalds they will die. That is not putting words in your mouth, that is literally what you just said, because you do not go into explain the reasonings, the exceptions, the basis of how that statement is true. To make it a true statement you must say "Eating McDonalds constantly without balancing it out with other nutients and lack of exercise will kill you over time". See the difference? You're stating the top and that's it. You did it again in your reply to me by stating how poisonous McDonalds is.

Uhh no.  Telling me that I "literally said those things" that I never said?  LOL.  No points for you here.  And I never said "eating McDonalds will kill you," I said "McDonalds is healthy by no standards," which I still stand by 100%.  And then you went on to talk about vegan diets and fruit juice and stuff, which I certainly do not support as being healthy.

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I am perfectly healthy. I eat fast food for the large majority of my meals. Just yesterday I ate a huge serving of beef fat french fries(these things are so damn delicious). I consume quite a lot of alcohol, I smoke, I don't exercise very much... and I am completely healthy. Are you going to say I'm not? My doctor will disagree with you. I kind of trust him more than you. But according to everything you said, I should be a lifeless pile of fat with organs that do not work.

There are many things worse than beef fat french fries.  As I said in my previous post, deep fried foods in lard are much less bad for you than deep fried foods in vegetable oil.

But if you keep on parading eating unhealthy, smoking, consuming lots of alcohol, and not exercising, you may be healthy now but I suspect (but cannot promise) health at this lifestyle will not last for too many more years.  But, I don't expect you to take my word for that.

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Health, nutrition and what the human body needs VARIES SO MUCH BETWEEN PEOPLE that stating certain blanket statements are complely baseless. The idea of nutrition works on the idea of a control standard of food. Nutritional facts are based on 2000 calorie diets and most people do not live on 2000 calorie diets. If people want to eat McDonalds they can. It won't kill them. It's just not the "healthiest".

Well, yes and no.  As I said in the first post, there are more issues at stake than just calories alone.

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And besides that the biggest thing in this is... who gives a damn if it's unhealthy. Not everyone cares about taking perfect care of their health, because I will straight you say right now that you do not. Is this a huge claim? Yes, but it's true, because no one does. No one exercises the perfect amount every day. No one eats their perfect nutritional balance. Everyone indulges in things that are not healthy sometimes. Some days you over sleep, some days you undersleep, but you know what? That is your damn choice to make. If I want to eat a tub of ice cream, I damn well can eat a tub of ice cream. If I want to put a bunch of hot sauce on my food, I can and will. People do not eat just to stay healthy, people eat to enjoy the food they eat. People eat what is convenient, fast, or whatever it is they feel like doing at the time. Or are you against this and saying, people should ban food that is not healthy? Candy stores shouldn't exist, because candy is bad for kids? They shouldn't allow candy to be sold right? Let's ban chocolate, because that stuff is bad for people. ALL DESERT PLACES MUST GO!!!!!!! This is a health liquidation, only healthy things should exist, stores should not be allowed to sell unhealthy stuff. Because we're not taking away your choice to eat it, we're taking away the stores what they can and cannot sell.

Well, I never advocated banning McDonalds altogether; what I support is changing how things are marketed towards kids and as I said before any step in the right direction is a good one.  You can still buy all the same items as before but the kids package is going to have different proportions.  Kids don't always know what's best for them & shouldn't be held fully responsible for such.  Heck, some adults don't even know either but I figure once they reach that age they become responsible for themselves.
Fyi, dark chocolate is actually very good for you, it's the excessive sugar & other things inside that makes it bad.

You have no clue how old I am, nor how long I have been eating the way I have. So the suspicion of it not lasting many more years is quite presumptious. What if I just started eating like this? Then I would have plenty of years, or not so many years because I used to eat healthy and eating like this will cause my body to go completely out of whack since it's not used to it. Or I could have been doing it for the past 40 years, in which case, my doctor who knows my habits has stated that I am completely healthy and has not told me that *IF I DON'T CHANGE MY HABITS I'M GOING TO DIE SOON!"

You see, you can't get your mind around the idea of black and white. And you also fail at following a conversation and that not every single point has to be exactly about the exact subject you are talking about. They are called examples and comparisons.

Just because something is labeled as "bad" doesn't make it bad. And just because something is labeled as "good" doesn't make it good. Dark chocolate is healthy in extremely small doses. It's harmful if you eat too much. You shifted to the marketing aspect. This has nothing to do with "it's telling companies what they can and cannot sell". Your words not mine. If you're saying that they must change their marketing aspect, then again, you're wrong. The reason why you can advertise cigarettes in kids magazines is because it's illegal for them to buy said magazines anyways. (I wonder if your'e really going to get into a marketing argument with me)... so marketing to kids is quite dumb. It's not even profitable for the comapny to begin with since they can't buy them. What they want to market to is people in their later teens. 17-18. So when they can get into them, they buy them so they can start young and keep buying them. But hey... that's not for this thread.

A business is not doing harm if they release a product. They have every right to advertise to whomever they want, and they have everyright to sell anything that is legal. It is up to the consumer to decide whether or not they should or should not buy/consume said product. I'm far from a republican or convervative but I don't believe that the government should spoon feed and hand walk every single person in the country and allow them and not allow them to do anything. If a kid wants a damned hamburger, it is up to the parent to tell them yes or no. If an adult wants a hamburger, it is up to them to say I'm gonig to buy a hamburger or that they think they should eat something healthier.


What's funny is I didn't tell you how those fries were even prepared completely by the way. You just automatically assumed that they were healthier... to act like your argument was valid.

Everything is about moderation and everything is up to the person who buys it. You have no right to tell me that what I'm doing is wrong if I decide to buy something that you deem as unhealthy, because for all you know, for my personal body, it's not. So get off your god damned high horse of what you think people should eat and allow them to make their own decision. When someone approaches you and ASKS FOR WHAT YOU THINK THEY  SHOULD EAT IN TERMS OF HEALTH, then you can tell them what you think. Until then, it's not up to you.

Quote from: PyronIkari on May 24, 2011, 04:34:06 PM
You have no clue how old I am, nor how long I have been eating the way I have. So the suspicion of it not lasting many more years is quite presumptious. What if I just started eating like this? Then I would have plenty of years, or not so many years because I used to eat healthy and eating like this will cause my body to go completely out of whack since it's not used to it. Or I could have been doing it for the past 40 years, in which case, my doctor who knows my habits has stated that I am completely healthy and has not told me that *IF I DON'T CHANGE MY HABITS I'M GOING TO DIE SOON!"

I never said or claimed that I knew how old you were or how long you've been eating the way you have, nor do I care.  What I am saying is if someone keeps on following an unhealthy lifestyle, then they'll start to break down sooner than if they don't.  THAT'S ALL.

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You see, you can't get your mind around the idea of black and white. And you also fail at following a conversation and that not every single point has to be exactly about the exact subject you are talking about. They are called examples and comparisons.

I never said that every point had to be about the exact subject.  What I called you out on was 1) You telling me that I said things that I didn't say, and 2) You not being correct on specific examples (i.e. kimchi.)

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Just because something is labeled as "bad" doesn't make it bad. And just because something is labeled as "good" doesn't make it good. Dark chocolate is healthy in extremely small doses. It's harmful if you eat too much.

Yes, I agree with all of this.  Example: Eggs, coconut oil, and avocados: labeled as bad by many, but actually very good.  McDonald's food: labeled as bad, and actually bad. 

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A business is not doing harm if they release a product. They have every right to advertise to whomever they want, and they have everyright to sell anything that is legal. It is up to the consumer to decide whether or not they should or should not buy/consume said product. I'm far from a republican or convervative but I don't believe that the government should spoon feed and hand walk every single person in the country and allow them and not allow them to do anything. If a kid wants a damned hamburger, it is up to the parent to tell them yes or no. If an adult wants a hamburger, it is up to them to say I'm gonig to buy a hamburger or that they think they should eat something healthier.

Now you're playing legality as a trump card.  If it becomes "illegal" to sell Happy Meals that have too much bad fats/calories, then what will be your next excuse?

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What's funny is I didn't tell you how those fries were even prepared completely by the way. You just automatically assumed that they were healthier... to act like your argument was valid.

^^^now THIS is you just trying to create an unnecessary argument.  If you were withholding pertinent information, then it needn't be deemed as relevant & I don't need to ask you for specifics before saying something like "there are many things worse than beef fat french fries" and "deep fried foods in lard are much less bad for you than deep fried foods in vegetable oil."  And going even further, I talked about beef fat fries being healthier than rancid vegetable fat fries.  I didn't say "those specific fries you ate are guaranteed to be healthier than all vegetable fat fries on the planet."  Are you happy now?

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Everything is about moderation and everything is up to the person who buys it. You have no right to tell me that what I'm doing is wrong if I decide to buy something that you deem as unhealthy, because for all you know, for my personal body, it's not. So get off your god damned high horse of what you think people should eat and allow them to make their own decision. When someone approaches you and ASKS FOR WHAT YOU THINK THEY  SHOULD EAT IN TERMS OF HEALTH, then you can tell them what you think. Until then, it's not up to you.

PyronIkari, I never went up to anyone and told then what they should eat.  Sheesh, talk about trying to put words in my mouth.  What I said is that I support regulations making McDonalds being healthier esp. when it comes to their products that are marketed towards children.

Quote from: hikanteki on May 24, 2011, 01:02:59 PM

Quote from: PyronIkari on May 24, 2011, 11:23:57 AM
Because now you're restricting people and telling people what they can and cannot eat. If I want to eat something unhealthy, who are you to tell me I cannot go out and buy it and eat it? Two cartoons have done an entire episode based on this very thing. King of the Hill and American Dad both did episodes about trans fat banning. You're basically saying that it's okay for the government to mandate what we can and cannot eat because some people are too stupid to make rational decisions.

It's not about telling people what they can and cannot eat, it's telling companies what they can and cannot sell.  Big difference.

A logical fallacy? Possibly an appeal to popularity. In any case, similar was attempted by ratification of the 18th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution on January 16, 1919.

There is also a related anime: "Chocolate Underground".    ;D

Even if there was no toy, the kids would still want McDonald's cause it tastes DELICIOUS! Also parents need to stop being such idiots. McDonald's is in NO WAY responsible for childhood obesity. Not even a little. It is the job of the parent to care for the child, and if that kid becomes obese, I honestly believe that is a form of child abuse and that kid should be taken away from the parent. I AM FURIOUS ABOUT FAT CHILDREN. I have seen 7 year olds that weigh more than me, eating double cheeseburgers and french fries. Don't tell me it's a restaurant's fault. Next thing you know, we won't be able to sell any junk food at all because mom can't say no.  >:(