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Author Topic: Favoritism in the Artist Alley  (Read 6069 times)

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Topagae

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Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« on: April 13, 2011, 12:59:50 PM »

So the Artist Alley ran out of tables, and I'm crying favoritism.

For a very long while at the official start of the registration, the link to the registration was very very broken. I had to get it from someone who already knew it and even though I registered in the "Special" group of folk before the regular folk could register on the actual site I'm in a "Lottery" to get in. What I'm angry about is that the people who had a back door of already knowing the link, due to from interviewing regular is that they KNOW people who put Fanime on. They all got there "first" while others had to sit there on a broken website wondering when registration would go up. And now that the people with insider knowledge get their seats the rest have to be picked randomly.

I'd like to propose that due to the outage and the early grabbing of seats, "First come first serve" is not fair, but a form of favoritism based on selective insider-knowledge. If it was really fair everyone would be a part of this lottery to get into the Artist Alley.

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phr34kish

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #1 on: April 13, 2011, 01:14:27 PM »

I know a lot of people were upset about the link not posted on the website. But they made sure and posted in multiple areas that everyone would know when and where the link would be available. The sent a time and place in an email, they posted it here on the forums, and they also did it on twitter and facebook. You could even link twitter to send a text message to your phone to get notices away from the computer. And from what it sounds like, most of the applicants were there during the server overload and got the link from the offsite locations the moment Fanime put up the link (almost exactly when they said they would.)

Yes, granted, I was allowed a table this go around, but I'm not sure you're cry for "favoritism" holds water. I've never had a table in the AA before, and I just followed the advice and steps provided on all the Fanime groups to make sure I got in. :/ They made information available to everyone, I'm finding it hard to believe they singled any one person, or group of people out.
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solipoo

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #2 on: April 13, 2011, 03:01:46 PM »

i did exactly what phr34kish stated. this is my first AA, and i was able to find the link in multiple places. i don't know anyone on the staff. i never got any of this so called "insider" knowledge. i think the first come first serve is totally fair.

fanime is a popular convention. not everyone is going to get a table. deal with it, and next year when AA registration comes around don't just "sit there on a broken website wondering when registration would go up", and do something about it. it was NOT hard to find the link, as long as you were proactive.

sorry if i sound mean here. i'm really not, but you shouldn't go blaming people for something you are upset about. i tried really hard to get the table, and i'm really angry you seem to think that everyone who got a table has "insider" knowledge. 8I
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Oniko

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #3 on: April 13, 2011, 03:11:53 PM »

Even when I got my hands on the link it still took me an hour of waiting for the page to load correctly and I still got my table. Not to mention I was registering a group and many know that that on it's own problems here and there.  Unfortunately not everyone can get a table, it happens.  It is a shame you didnt get one but obviously not everyone who applied would be allowed one.
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jAded

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #4 on: April 13, 2011, 03:19:48 PM »

Topagae - I have no idea what favoritism you are referring to. And there is no 'special' group of people singled out for advance registration. It used to be that artists could buy their tables at the con the year before, but they don't do that anymore. There was no backdoor. Despite the delays in registration this year, Fanime went about making sure every form of online networking site was utilized so that people could be up to date with updates. Twitter, forums, facebook, email.... It's hard to believe that you didn't take the opportunity to check out the forums (where people who've never been to AA etc,) where questions are posted and answered on a daily basis or look at the other sites for any information when you weren't sure. They didn't have to even move things around to open up more tables. They could have cut it off after the tables were filled.

And it's not just a few people that were informed about registration (as noted by the fact that the tables were sold out when registration opened). That in itself shows that artists were well informed.
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Miss S

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #5 on: April 13, 2011, 04:00:59 PM »

My group did not know the link beforehand. We do not know the staff personally. We had no insider knowledge beyond our experience from years past. We got in, but not through any special means.

Sorry you're in the lottery, sorry you're angry, but accusing the people who worked hard to be some of the first to get in, and the staff, of cheating is not the way to deal with it.
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catnapcaps

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #6 on: April 13, 2011, 04:08:17 PM »

I will agree that the way registration happened was somewhat flawed to an extent, but I don't think favoritism comes into play here. This is the 2nd time I've tried to participate in Fanime's AA (registered 2 weeks after reg opened last year and didn't make it in). I was expecting that the link would appear on the home page or the artist page, but it didn't until hours later. However, I learned from my past AA experiences to constantly watch any area, especially forums and facebook for information. My partner and I were constantly checking for updates and we put ourselves on the mailing list, joined the FB group and my partner was following their twitter account. I found the link on FB page (which has 100+ other followers, so it's not like it's a tiny secret organization) and it took me about 40 minutes to make and confirm an AA account what with all the traffic the site was getting. The links were then posted in the forums in a thread after 1PM and I've been reading that it also appeared as a message while the forums were down, around 9pm a non clickable link went on the main page, (which could be copied and pasted) and maybe 30 mins-1hr later it was fixed so you could actually click it.

Unfortunately, spots at large cons are usually highly sought after and they will run out quickly. For example AX, which is bigger than Fanime sold out in 5 minutes in 2008 or 2007 (can't remember which). I was at a smaller con in January that had it's AA tables sell out in 1-2 minutes. It's just not possible for everyone to have a spot. A lot of the time you have to be diligent and check for updates constantly. It's unfortunate you didn't get in on the first come first serve spot, but at least they did add additional tables to at least try to accommodate more people, which they really don't have to do.  
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themalletofjustice

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #7 on: April 13, 2011, 08:05:06 PM »

I for one had no idea where the link would be posted and just ended up finding it on my own from the forums, and then, almost immediately after that I saw it on facebook. The only reason I thought to look on the forums was because, like CatNapCaps said, of a past AA experience. I think it would've been a little better if an emphasis on checking the forums and other networking sites was posted on the main site (maybe a line or two) way before the whole registration process started. I know it was made clear on the forums and elsewhere, but there will always be people who think that all major announcements must and will hit the main site first and unfortunately, sometimes that's just not possible. So while I don't agree that there was favoritism involved, I do feel that some people were at a slight disadvantage.
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geekyglamorous

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #8 on: April 15, 2011, 11:48:38 AM »

As disappointed as I am that my friend and I were not able to get a table I really don't think favoritism was at play here. Unfortunately we didn't think to check the FB or forums until 9pm the day registration went up and although we did register I guess I'm not surprised that we didn't get in. It's easy to jump to conclusions and make accusations when you're upset but really, when anything goes wrong online it's always best to check official forums and other social networks to see if others have the same issues. Here's hoping we have luck in the lottery.
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PyronIkari

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #9 on: April 15, 2011, 02:17:47 PM »

So the Artist Alley ran out of tables, and I'm crying favoritism.

For a very long while at the official start of the registration, the link to the registration was very very broken. I had to get it from someone who already knew it and even though I registered in the "Special" group of folk before the regular folk could register on the actual site I'm in a "Lottery" to get in. What I'm angry about is that the people who had a back door of already knowing the link, due to from interviewing regular is that they KNOW people who put Fanime on. They all got there "first" while others had to sit there on a broken website wondering when registration would go up. And now that the people with insider knowledge get their seats the rest have to be picked randomly.

I'd like to propose that due to the outage and the early grabbing of seats, "First come first serve" is not fair, but a form of favoritism based on selective insider-knowledge. If it was really fair everyone would be a part of this lottery to get into the Artist Alley.

If you're complaining about favoritism on this I don't even know what you'd say happened with San Diego Comic Con. I'm sorry but you can't blame technical issues on favoritism. The page broke because of technical issues/traffic/etc. Things like this happen. When things like this happen, most people find alternatives to see what/why happened. Don't blame others for your lack of initiative in trying to find out what happened. Hundreds of other people Saw a broken site, and went to see what happened. They found alternative source for link, and registered.

Really, what do you want to achieve by stating this? I don't understand your point. Are you trying to say that, because there was a technical problem... everyone that didn't get a table should be given a table? Or maybe they should play favoritism and give you a table because you're complaining?Beacuse that would totally make sense right?

You and hundred of other people experienced the exact same thing. No one was told about the registration process prior to the time it was announced. No one was given secret information before any one else. Hundreds of people wanted to register, those that were proactive got to, the others didn't.

no one OWES YOU a table. You do not have right over others to get a table, just like no one else had right over you. So come again now... what are you trying to achieve?
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ewu

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #10 on: April 15, 2011, 02:51:21 PM »

Pyron - I don't think that tone is necessarily needed. Yes, the AA staff are working hard, but the artists are understandably frustrated.

Artists - Please keep our situation in mind and we will continue to present the best con that we can.

Thanks,
Eric
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SukebeStudios

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #11 on: April 16, 2011, 02:43:33 AM »

Look, I don't think there's favoritism, personally. It just doesn't seem like they're completely forthcoming with information, which just makes it APPEAR that there's shady-ness going on. I understand that the staff is volunteer, and works EXTREMELY hard, and I can appreciate their efforts.

The feeling I'm getting from the staff, is like, "Sorry, we made a mistake. So what?"

This is the first time I've registered for a table, so I don't know if it's like this every year. I'd like to assume the better of Staff and guess this is just an accident that messed up the reg this year. If it ISN'T an accident, and this DOES happen every year, then it makes the staff appear uncaring about Artist Alley. But as I said, I'm hoping it's just a freak accident.

Also, I may be wrong, but I thought that notices were going to be sent to artists that they were going to be entered into the lottery. The only notice I received was when I checked my AA account status, and it said only that I wasn't getting a table. Nothing about a lottery. So much for the lottery then?
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Haruka

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #12 on: April 16, 2011, 11:27:01 AM »

I, too, need to register my extreme dissatisfaction with how Artists Alley sign-ups were handled this year.  When the registration first appeared on the website, the message was basically, "It's not first-come-first-serve, we'll be going through the applicants one by one and choosing who gets in based on whether or not they meet the requirements."  Therefore I was not in a rush to sign.  I had an account in the 400s but was again reassured that the account number had nothing to do with my place in the registration process as it wasn't a first-come-first-serve situation...until the rules got changed in the middle of the process, I suspect because there were not enough volunteers to handle the amount of applications, which should not have been a surprise since Artists Alley is like this every year.  Then, all of the sudden it was first-come-first-serve and your account number pretty much let you know whether or not you were in before registration even closed. 

Now I don't have a problem with FCFS, but I would have appreciated a little more honesty and realism at the beginning the process and not have chances dashed because someone decided to change the rules in the middle of the game.  I was also never directly contacted regarding my registration status for better or worse.  The only reason I found out I was not accepted was by checking my account.  So, again, we are being told one thing only to be shown something else.
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Oniko

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #13 on: April 16, 2011, 12:17:06 PM »

I guess I'm failing to see where a "Mistake" was made.  I dont see any misleading info on getting tables.  Where are you reading this from the staff? I'm curious to read it.

Basically no process will every be perfect, you cant please everyone, and not everyone will get in.  Though I think leaving comments about how to improve are good. I still believe it is better then the old mail in check method.  I also think it's very generous of them to be moving around their set up structure to fit more tables then originally planned.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2011, 12:32:32 PM by Oniko »
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jAded

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #14 on: April 16, 2011, 06:34:55 PM »

Haruka - It was always a first come first serve basis with the tables, they just added that this year they were doing portfolio reviews on top of that. The only thing that staff did say was that the number was randomly generated, and that it had nothing to do with what order you registered.
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Haruka

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #15 on: April 16, 2011, 10:01:46 PM »

Since this is the first year I tried to sign-up, how would I know that?  It was not clearly stated.  The message that popped up after account submission gave the impression that registration would be accepted until the 15th at which time accounts would be reviewed and accepted.  Nowhere was FCFS even implied.  And if it was FCFS, why have a two week registration period when it appears all the places were spoken for and then some by 12a 3/26?  Like I said, a little more clarity and realism at the beginning of the process would have been appreciated.
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solipoo

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #16 on: April 16, 2011, 11:56:20 PM »

I just looked at the email the staff sent out before AA opened and the AA FAQ and you're right Haruka, I didn't see anything saying that it would be first come first serve. But I feel like I read it somewhere... or maybe I just assumed that it would be FCFS. (This is my first AA too) I mean, I think usually AA tables are first come first serve, at most conventions. If it weren't, then how do the staff pick? Just by best art? Lottery for everyone? Both of those sound extremely unreasonable and unfair.

But I agree to some extent that perhaps they should have made some aspects of the AA clearer. During registration, I was pretty much spamming the facebook group chat with questions and freaking out. Haha xD;;

Also I think the two week registration was for just in case people drop out/people aren't approved. If they closed it right after the exact number was filled, then less people would have a chance. I heard that a lot of people end up not showing up for their tables at the con/other things come up so they can't go.
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PyronIkari

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #17 on: April 17, 2011, 02:32:35 AM »

Since this is the first year I tried to sign-up, how would I know that?  It was not clearly stated.  The message that popped up after account submission gave the impression that registration would be accepted until the 15th at which time accounts would be reviewed and accepted.  Nowhere was FCFS even implied.  And if it was FCFS, why have a two week registration period when it appears all the places were spoken for and then some by 12a 3/26?  Like I said, a little more clarity and realism at the beginning of the process would have been appreciated.

It's a little thing called logic. Okay, even if it's not stated first come first serve. Let's say... they get 1000 applicants. And 800 of them are "passable". They don't have 800 tables to give away. So which of those 800 applicants get chosen? Obviously the ones that registered first.

It's understandable to be upset that you didn't get a table, but seriously, you're trying to push blame on others instead of just accepting you made some bad choices. Even if you didn't make those bad choices you're not guaranteed a table. Like seriously, what would you want have been done? If you are serious about getting a table, you'd do everything you can to make sure all your info is in as early as possible, organized, nice cut and clean. That's how others felt, and that's how they acted. You just assumed things and put it off thinking "Well they didn't specifically state that it is first come first serve therefore I can put this off as long as I want". Submissions are looked at as they come in(when time is available). If they got x amount of passable before you even submitted, sorry that is no ones fault but yourself.

Think of it this way. If there is a job opening at a company and they say "Applications and interviews will be accepted starting April 17th, deadline is April 30th: 3 job positions open" and you take that as "Oh I have time I'll just apply on the 29th." You have no one to blame but yourself if the job positions are filled by applicants that were good for the job, had their applications in on the 17th and interviewed on the 18th. If this happen, would you seriously e-mail the company and complain that the website said it was not first come first serve and that it stated the deadline was on the 30th? A deadline is just a deadline, it doesn't mean anyone that fills in info by the deadline has a fully equal chance.

You need to remember, when it's competitive to fill in slots, slacking off will result in your failure. Here let's try this again. I'll even use your words.

"registration would be accepted until the 15th at which time accounts would be reviewed and accepted."

You were able to register right? You received a number that shows you were put on a waiting list, which means you registered for a table. You did not receive a table, but you registered for a chance to get one. So that statement is 100% correct and not misleading.

"FCFS, why have a two week registration period when it appears all the places were spoken for and then some by 12a 3/26?"
A 2 week registration period allows a grace for waiting list. You cannot guess exactly how long it will take to fill up the open slots, and who knows how many of those people that registered will not drop out. A lot of people end up not being able to afford it, not being able to make it, or deciding that they don't want to do it. So a 2week registration period allows a queue to happen to fill up the slots completely with dropouts etc.

It's all pretty clear. The irony to me is how much effort you're putting in to state how it was unfair, when if you put in this effort to register it shouldn't have been a problem.
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jAded

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #18 on: April 17, 2011, 02:46:21 AM »

Hakura - I understand you're not happy that you didn't get at table, but we were all first AA'ers at one point and time. From experience, when I was unsure about any information regarding any aspect of the convention, the clarification was a post away (in the forums, so I would assume you knew there was a forum for the convention where questions could be asked) or an email away. Your interpretation of what you thought the email to say could have been easily cleared up with a quick note.

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Kimba616

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Re: Favoritism in the Artist Alley
« Reply #19 on: April 17, 2011, 09:37:23 PM »

When it first come first serve not in effect for convention events?  Thinking otherwise for something like this is kind of silly.  :\
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