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Stormfalcon

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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #220 on: February 11, 2008, 10:28:49 PM »

And it is in no way the "spirit of the con" (whatever the hell that's supposed to be).  It's only been an issue for the past few years.  Fanime has been around much longer than that and glomping wasn't a problem until after we moved to the San Jose Convention Center.
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phoenixphire24

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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #221 on: February 12, 2008, 09:28:12 AM »

its not that its bad or anything, just that some people dont know exactly how much force they are putting into said glomp itself.

Some may be careful when they go for a glomp, but there are some that go into it like they're trying out for the high school football team: full force without thinking.

This is true... people don't embrace people randomly on the street and if they do it's not really well received so I'm not sure why this happens at cons so much. I suppose I'm just used to it.

 
thats the spirit of con.=D is con like walking in the street? no, people have costumes and generally expect to even have their pictures taken with random people and more or less meet/be amongst other fans. You can't tell me you can compare that to an average walk down the street.

Being asked for pictures or meeting with people is not the issue. It's people who are touching, jumping on, hugging, and otherwise tackling others (aka glomping). We're also not talking about glompers who ask permission. This is about glompers who do so without asking the person first, risking damage to costumes and possible injury to the person being glomped. There's also those of us who DO NOT WANT TO BE TOUCHED BY STRANGERS. I don't care if this is a con or walking down the street. I enjoy my personal space!
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Long

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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #222 on: February 20, 2008, 11:46:00 PM »

It won't feel like Fanime anymore if glomping is banned. Sure, I never liked it myself, but it's hilarious to watch it happen to other people. x3

Aren't signs banned as well? Last year, we tried having our usual crazy late night Fanime fun, (basically doing any crazy shit we wanted to) and for the first time in years, we were yelled at. Fanime just isn't fun anymore.
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Stormfalcon

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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #223 on: February 20, 2008, 11:55:14 PM »

Take it from someone who's been going to Fanime since the Foothill days in the early '90s: glomping and signs are not what made Fanime what it is.  Taking them away will not detract from what Fanime is.  In fact, glomping and signs have made Fanime worse over the past few years and taking them away will serve to make things better once again.  It's all about respect for your fellow fans.
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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #224 on: February 21, 2008, 12:01:27 AM »

Take it from someone who's been going to Fanime since the Foothill days in the early '90s: glomping and signs are not what made Fanime what it is.  Taking them away will not detract from what Fanime is.  In fact, glomping and signs have made Fanime worse over the past few years and taking them away will serve to make things better once again.  It's all about respect for your fellow fans.

It may not make Fanime what it is in your eyes, but for me, Fanime was all about crazy fun. Not anal rules and regulations.
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Xeluu

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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #225 on: February 21, 2008, 01:48:28 AM »

Take it from someone who's been going to Fanime since the Foothill days in the early '90s: glomping and signs are not what made Fanime what it is.  Taking them away will not detract from what Fanime is.  In fact, glomping and signs have made Fanime worse over the past few years and taking them away will serve to make things better once again.  It's all about respect for your fellow fans.

It may not make Fanime what it is in your eyes, but for me, Fanime was all about crazy fun. Not anal rules and regulations.
I'm not sure what "anal rules and regulations" you're talking about. The rules that exist, exist for the safety of your fellow Con attendees.

Also, you said:
Last year, we tried having our usual crazy late night Fanime fun, (basically doing any crazy shit we wanted to) and for the first time in years, we were yelled at.
Doing "any crazy shit we wanted to" =/= Fanime. I'm not sure what you got yelled at for, but it was probably with good reason.

Most of what people have stated here is that they want their SAFETY and not to feel like they've just had their personal space invaded/assaulted. Common sense says ask before you glomp/hug/etc. That's ALL we're asking for.

Unfortunately though, sometimes all it takes is one person to ruin other people's fun.
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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #226 on: February 21, 2008, 06:25:09 AM »

Take it from someone who's been going to Fanime since the Foothill days in the early '90s: glomping and signs are not what made Fanime what it is.  Taking them away will not detract from what Fanime is.  In fact, glomping and signs have made Fanime worse over the past few years and taking them away will serve to make things better once again.  It's all about respect for your fellow fans.

It may not make Fanime what it is in your eyes, but for me, Fanime was all about crazy fun. Not anal rules and regulations.

Crazy fun for you that may end up equalling emotional or physical discomfort for another? How is that fun and fair?

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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #227 on: February 21, 2008, 10:24:58 AM »

Fanime is about having fun, but it can be taken a little too far.  I've never been glomped in my four years cosplaying at Fanime, but it seems like it would be annoying to be on the recieving end of one.  I'm not that strong either, that girl might have knocked me over if she expected me to catch her.

The second one where she hugs Naruto and even kisses him.  That's what I want. :D
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MidnightRosebud

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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #228 on: February 21, 2008, 01:37:37 PM »

I could not believe my eyes last year with the amount of "Hug Me," "Kiss Me," and the even more popular "Glomp Me," signs that were going around, especially Saturday night. If you are wearing one, expect people to really get into it and nearly tackle you.
However, running and jumping ontop of your favorite character if they do not invite you to do so should be kept to a reasonable level this year. So, I concur with you.
I cannot view the YouTube video ant the moment, but I do remember that someone accidentally broke a piece of another cosplayer's costumer by jumping/tackling them. That was not a good idea. -.-;;
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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #229 on: February 21, 2008, 02:56:29 PM »

Take it from someone who's been going to Fanime since the Foothill days in the early '90s: glomping and signs are not what made Fanime what it is.  Taking them away will not detract from what Fanime is.  In fact, glomping and signs have made Fanime worse over the past few years and taking them away will serve to make things better once again.  It's all about respect for your fellow fans.

It may not make Fanime what it is in your eyes, but for me, Fanime was all about crazy fun. Not anal rules and regulations.
I'm not sure what "anal rules and regulations" you're talking about. The rules that exist, exist for the safety of your fellow Con attendees.

Also, you said:
Last year, we tried having our usual crazy late night Fanime fun, (basically doing any crazy shit we wanted to) and for the first time in years, we were yelled at.
Doing "any crazy shit we wanted to" =/= Fanime. I'm not sure what you got yelled at for, but it was probably with good reason.

Most of what people have stated here is that they want their SAFETY and not to feel like they've just had their personal space invaded/assaulted. Common sense says ask before you glomp/hug/etc. That's ALL we're asking for.

Unfortunately though, sometimes all it takes is one person to ruin other people's fun.
I got yelled at because we were hiding behind a table desk thing for hide-and-seek. I don't glomp or hug anyone because I have contact issues, but it is normal con fare. I would expect it. When it happens to me, I don't get pissed. I agree that they should ask first though. But banning it entirely is idiotic. And what's up with the sign thing? Did someone make pornographic signs or something?

Doing "any crazy shit we wanted to" = Fanime. For me at least. Everyone has their own definition of Fanime. Mine is different than yours. Deal with it.

And you're right. It does only take one person to ruin other people's fun. Like the idiot who decided all cons should be anal-retentive cesspits with no joy of freedom.
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phoenixphire24

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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #230 on: February 21, 2008, 03:39:21 PM »

Take it from someone who's been going to Fanime since the Foothill days in the early '90s: glomping and signs are not what made Fanime what it is.  Taking them away will not detract from what Fanime is.  In fact, glomping and signs have made Fanime worse over the past few years and taking them away will serve to make things better once again.  It's all about respect for your fellow fans.

It may not make Fanime what it is in your eyes, but for me, Fanime was all about crazy fun. Not anal rules and regulations.
I'm not sure what "anal rules and regulations" you're talking about. The rules that exist, exist for the safety of your fellow Con attendees.

Also, you said:
Last year, we tried having our usual crazy late night Fanime fun, (basically doing any crazy shit we wanted to) and for the first time in years, we were yelled at.
Doing "any crazy shit we wanted to" =/= Fanime. I'm not sure what you got yelled at for, but it was probably with good reason.

Most of what people have stated here is that they want their SAFETY and not to feel like they've just had their personal space invaded/assaulted. Common sense says ask before you glomp/hug/etc. That's ALL we're asking for.

Unfortunately though, sometimes all it takes is one person to ruin other people's fun.
I got yelled at because we were hiding behind a table desk thing for hide-and-seek. I don't glomp or hug anyone because I have contact issues, but it is normal con fare. I would expect it. When it happens to me, I don't get pissed. I agree that they should ask first though. But banning it entirely is idiotic. And what's up with the sign thing? Did someone make pornographic signs or something?

Doing "any crazy shit we wanted to" = Fanime. For me at least. Everyone has their own definition of Fanime. Mine is different than yours. Deal with it.

And you're right. It does only take one person to ruin other people's fun. Like the idiot who decided all cons should be anal-retentive cesspits with no joy of freedom.

Sorry, but doing "any crazy shit we wanted to" is usually what leads to anal-retentive rules at cons. You and your friends are a small number of the 12,000+ attendees, plus guests (who may not be from America), dealers, other presenters, and who ever else might be around that is not involved with the con. Certain rules are in place to keep everyone safe and makes the convention center and the city of San Jose want to have Fanime back year after year. As cheesy as it might sound, when you are at a con, you represent anime fans and messing around and causing problems gives other anime fans and Fanime a bad name. Do you think guests from over seas want to come to cons where people are running around and acting like idiots? Coming to a con and being with your friends and other anime fans does not entitle you to act as you please. Everyone should have a good time and still be able to act appropriately. If you and your friends can't do this, than please go elsewhere.
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Jun-Watarase

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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #231 on: February 21, 2008, 03:42:48 PM »

I got yelled at because we were hiding behind a table desk thing for hide-and-seek.

See, I can imagine a couple of kids getting scolded for doing this in a public setting but...?

Quote
I don't glomp or hug anyone because I have contact issues, but it is normal con fare. I would expect it. When it happens to me, I don't get pissed. I agree that they should ask first though. But banning it entirely is idiotic. And what's up with the sign thing? Did someone make pornographic signs or something?

If you had read other posts on the thread, no one's aiming to ban the act of glomping. That would be troublesome, and would pretty much become a "no touch" rule. Those sorts of regulations wouldn't even have to be considered if people weren't taking it so far. It isn't so much for the ACT of glomping that's negatively affecting people/the con, but the inconsiderate people who don't have common sense or any respect for personal space. For some kids and younger teenagers, I can understand to some extent... but for older teens and fully grown adults? Really, c'mon. So liek... this is probably the 10th + time I've repeated this.

As for the signs, they're annoying and excessive and promote idiotic behavior by whoring attention towards themselves. At first, tasteful signs with somewhat of a meaning seemed okay. Then a trend followed, and everywhere you look is a "Glomp Me!" sign. After a while, people started asking for money, then... things beyond that, like prostitution. Capice?

Quote
Doing "any crazy shit we wanted to" = Fanime. For me at least. Everyone has their own definition of Fanime. Mine is different than yours. Deal with it.

How about you deal with the fact that not EVERY SINGLE PERSON is an idiot, too? Fanime isn't a big playground for retards to do whatever the hell they want. It's an anime convention, and that's the primary way to define it. The only reason why you have this idea of Fanime is because some people who attend are in a never-ending competition of "who's more unique" and do stupid crap to get the attention of other people to think that they're different. As that progressed, people had the idea that they could do anything they wanted. No, sorry. Fanime, like many other social events, have rules and people have standards.

Quote
And you're right. It does only take one person to ruin other people's fun. Like the idiot who decided all cons should be anal-retentive cesspits with no joy of freedom.

... Are you a moron? From your post, you're pretty much implying that no one can have fun... without being incredibly stupid. Fanime isn't going to enforce a rule specifically against glomping, but it should be common sense that you shouldn't touch strangers. Not only that, but it's against the law. At first, people probably wouldn't have cared... BUT THIS HAPPENS FREQUENTLY and occasionally, people get hurt, and have their possessions damaged for absolutely no reason. But that's being anal, right? We might as well let people have fist fights in the lobby for money, since it's all in good fun. And I hope you don't mind me throwing my boot at your face, since I'd just find that hilarious. :V
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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #232 on: February 21, 2008, 09:48:40 PM »

I'm sorry, but to me, being an anime fan automatically implies that you are in some way idiotic. They very nature of most anime characters are idiotic, and anime fans usually try to act as much like their character as they possibly can, hence cosplaying and the like.

Quote from: Jun-Watarase
As for the signs, they're annoying and excessive and promote idiotic behavior by whoring attention towards themselves. At first, tasteful signs with somewhat of a meaning seemed okay. Then a trend followed, and everywhere you look is a "Glomp Me!" sign. After a while, people started asking for money, then... things beyond that, like prostitution. Capice?

I don't see what the issue is with attention whoring. Again, that's just another characteristic of anime fans. The entire point is to grab as much attention as you can, with your cosplay or whatever. Prostitution, however, is against the law. I have no qualms against the prohibition of that.

Quote from: Jun-Watarase
We might as well let people have fist fights in the lobby for money, since it's all in good fun. And I hope you don't mind me throwing my boot at your face, since I'd just find that hilarious. :V

Even though that was part of your argument, your suggestions sound absolutely hilarious and frankly quite awesome.

Quote from: Jun-Watarase
... Are you a moron? From your post, you're pretty much implying that no one can have fun... without being incredibly stupid.

Pretty much. Nothing else at Fanime draws much attention for me anymore. It's about being who you are with your friends. All that extra stuff means nothing to me.

Quote from: Jun-Watarase
How about you deal with the fact that not EVERY SINGLE PERSON is an idiot, too? Fanime isn't a big playground for retards to do whatever the hell they want. It's an anime convention, and that's the primary way to define it. The only reason why you have this idea of Fanime is because some people who attend are in a never-ending competition of "who's more unique" and do stupid crap to get the attention of other people to think that they're different. As that progressed, people had the idea that they could do anything they wanted. No, sorry. Fanime, like many other social events, have rules and people have standards.

"Anime convention" is just another word for "big playground for retards". People can have all the standards they want. Doesn't mean we have to follow them. You don't like my idiocy? Deal with it. I frankly don't care. Rules are a bit more tricky, perhaps, but like you said, they're not going to be banning it. How about we draw a line down the middle of the convention center. All the too serious people with sticks up their butts can stay on one side, and all the people who want to have fun can stand on the other. That's basically what your argument is coming down to. You don't like character of other people, and you want them to change to fit your "standards". We don't have to, not even in real society. Sure there are consequences, like being looked down upon, but when that doesn't bother you, there are no clear set rules against that sort of thing.

Quote from: phoenixphire24
Sorry, but doing "any crazy shit we wanted to" is usually what leads to anal-retentive rules at cons. You and your friends are a small number of the 12,000+ attendees, plus guests (who may not be from America), dealers, other presenters, and who ever else might be around that is not involved with the con. Certain rules are in place to keep everyone safe and makes the convention center and the city of San Jose want to have Fanime back year after year. As cheesy as it might sound, when you are at a con, you represent anime fans and messing around and causing problems gives other anime fans and Fanime a bad name. Do you think guests from over seas want to come to cons where people are running around and acting like idiots? Coming to a con and being with your friends and other anime fans does not entitle you to act as you please. Everyone should have a good time and still be able to act appropriately. If you and your friends can't do this, than please go elsewhere.

I don't give a damn about overseas guests. If certain people want to make a good impression, they can go ahead and do that, but you shouldn't limit the people that only want to have fun; forcing them to try and live up to some kind of stupid standard just so the other people don't feel like they haven't impressed their favorite guests or whatever. Everyone is different, and they have different ways of expressing themselves. I don't want to impress guests. And I don't give a fuck about the impression I give to the rest of the world or San Jose city. Labels are idiotic and I don't have to represent anything if I don't want to. If I do unintentionally, well it sucks for the people that adhere to that label, but it's not my problem. I act as I please, either at the con, or any place else, and nothing has to entitle me to that. I act appropriately enough not to get kicked out, but I'm sick of people who continue to try to create rules to stop people who just try to be who they are. If I want to act like an idiot, then I can very well act like an idiot if I please. I'm all for limiting the amount of rough-housing, but how the hell do you plan on creating a rule for that without banning it entirely? "Everyone must ask before they glomp." Is all nice and good on paper, but how the hell are you going to enforce it?

I'm just afraid that movements like this, and the banning of the signs (which I think is utterly stupid) is just a precursor for removing aspects of the con that I've always known to be there. I'm far removed from the fandom, and the reason I come to this con is just to hang out with my friends, and act like the idiot I am. It was a comfortable environment, because about 80% of the people there were idiots as well. Now the 20% are trying to enforce strict rules on the others to stop their fun and their freedom. It's basic elitism.

My proposed solution is perhaps informational pamphlets about glomping and perhaps sign usage that may dissuade people from doing it in the wrong manner, or to lay down the rules of etiquette of glomping or other exchanges with other con members. A manners booklet perhaps, before you set down a iron-clad rule. Let the con-goers regulate their own habits, and if they break etiquette, the victim can go to a con moderator to report harassment, or dish out their own punishment.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2008, 09:55:45 PM by Long »
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Stormfalcon

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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #233 on: February 21, 2008, 10:30:20 PM »

FanimeCon was never started for people to act like idiots to each other.  It started out as a gathering of the various local anime clubs to get together and enjoy anime.  Over the years, it grew into a good-sized convention, but the main purpose remained the same: the enjoyment of anime, not being idiots to each other, and it still remains that.  The reason why many of us want to see bans on signs and unwanted glomping is that both are detrimental to the main reason why we come to FanimeCon: the enjoyment of anime.  The signs are degrading to the con and the fans, and unwanted glomping is a violation of one's personal space and is, in fact, a crime (file under "assault").  For most of FanimeCon's existence, neither of these were a problem, and we'd like things to return to that state: not a problem.  As long as both are allowed, then yeah, they're going to be a problem that needs to be eliminated.  If that kind of shit is the only reason you come to Fanime, then may I suggest that you look elsewhere because it's increasingly unwelcome.
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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #234 on: February 21, 2008, 10:37:30 PM »

FanimeCon was never started for people to act like idiots to each other.  It started out as a gathering of the various local anime clubs to get together and enjoy anime.  Over the years, it grew into a good-sized convention, but the main purpose remained the same: the enjoyment of anime, not being idiots to each other, and it still remains that.  The reason why many of us want to see bans on signs and unwanted glomping is that both are detrimental to the main reason why we come to FanimeCon: the enjoyment of anime.  The signs are degrading to the con and the fans, and unwanted glomping is a violation of one's personal space and is, in fact, a crime (file under "assault").  For most of FanimeCon's existence, neither of these were a problem, and we'd like things to return to that state: not a problem.  As long as both are allowed, then yeah, they're going to be a problem that needs to be eliminated.  If that kind of shit is the only reason you come to Fanime, then may I suggest that you look elsewhere because it's increasingly unwelcome.

Who gives a damn about what fanime started as. All I'm worrying about is what it is now. You went to the con for ten years. Whoopdeedoo. No one cares. Things change. All of you serious bums flock to the forums now, but when Fanime actually comes around, the majority of the present population are idiots, and your "increasingly unwelcome" attitude towards them is going to have no effect. You may like anime. I hate the majority of that crap. I don't enjoy otaku, or ugly cosplayers, or annoying people to take things too seriously, but I let them be who they are, and do their thing. I don't turn on them in the con, or make fun of them. I make friends with them and hang out, because I accept them. I'm an idiot. That's my nature. You don't have to accept me if you don't want to however, but I'm willing to assure you that there will be many others who will.

I go to Fanime for what it's turned into. Not what it was, as do many people.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2008, 10:40:04 PM by Long »
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Stormfalcon

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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #235 on: February 21, 2008, 10:46:32 PM »

I would suggest you seriously consider why you go to FanimeCon and pay for it when you don't enjoy a lot of what it's there for.  If all you want to do is hang out with your friends, you can do it elsewhere without bothering the congoers who go to Fanime for what it's there for (the anime, the cosplayers, the fellow otaku), for free.  That's right, you can be idiots elsewhere without paying a dime and not even bother other people in the process.  Think about it.
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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #236 on: February 21, 2008, 11:02:33 PM »

I would suggest you seriously consider why you go to FanimeCon and pay for it when you don't enjoy a lot of what it's there for.  If all you want to do is hang out with your friends, you can do it elsewhere without bothering the congoers who go to Fanime for what it's there for (the anime, the cosplayers, the fellow otaku), for free.  That's right, you can be idiots elsewhere without paying a dime and not even bother other people in the process.  Think about it.

While that is true, Fanime is a tradition for us. I'm not a big fan of anime, but my friends are. I don't think anyone should be barred from Fanime, if all they want to do is go there to have a good time. There's no rule that states you must like anime or manga to go to a con. Fanime is one time I can do something with my friends that they enjoy, while adding to the experience with my own brand of crazy fun. Aside from that fact, I'm addicted to MusicFest. ;B Spending 50 dollars on a con badge is worth it for MF. x3
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Stormfalcon

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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #237 on: February 21, 2008, 11:15:42 PM »

That's all well and good, but is it really asking too much to act in a civil manner while at Fanime?  If you can't act in a civil manner at the very least, then you shouldn't be there at all (or anywhere in public for that matter).  That means no unwanted glomps at the very least since they are a form of assault, and signs should be out as well because many of them in the past could be seen as a form of prostitution ("Will yaoi/yuri for Pocky" ring a bell?).
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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #238 on: February 21, 2008, 11:21:50 PM »

That's all well and good, but is it really asking too much to act in a civil manner while at Fanime?  If you can't act in a civil manner at the very least, then you shouldn't be there at all (or anywhere in public for that matter).  That means no unwanted glomps at the very least since they are a form of assault, and signs should be out as well because many of them in the past could be seen as a form of prostitution ("Will yaoi/yuri for Pocky" ring a bell?).

I already provided my solution for glomping. Hand out etiquette pamphlets with the standard set of Con handouts. As for the prostitution, you could stop them legally. Prostitution is illegal in all its forms throughout the US. Expressing that prostitution is a federal offense, will no doubt dissuade people from engaging in making signs implying prostitution. But the other types of signs, I see no problem with.

And quite frankly, it depends on your definition of a "civil manner". I'm generally, quite hyper, and I don't give a damn about the opinions of others, so I act up as I please. No one has the right to say that if I don't "act civil" that I shouldn't be there at all. It's not in the rules, or a specific con guideline. If I want to be a hyper spazzmatic idiot, then I can be (providing of course, that I remain responsible for my actions).
« Last Edit: February 21, 2008, 11:25:18 PM by Long »
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Stormfalcon

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Re: Things that need to not happen at Fanime
« Reply #239 on: February 21, 2008, 11:35:37 PM »

It is, however, against the law to make unwanted physical contact, and unwanted glomps would be included in this.  It's not etiquette...it's a legal matter.  If you can't understand this and proceed to "act up as you please", then I sincerely hope that you enjoy a nice, free room at the local jail, because that's what you would deserve if you decide that you're entitled to glomp people that don't want to be glomped for various, legitimate reasons.
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