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FanimeCon Events and Discussionmentarianism => General Convention Discussion => Topic started by: ewu on April 07, 2016, 11:26:23 AM

Title: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: ewu on April 07, 2016, 11:26:23 AM
Dear FanimeCon Members,

Over the years, FanimeCon has grown substantially from our small club roots to one of the largest Anime Cons in North America. Along the way, we’ve experienced growing pains like any other convention or event. The staff of FanimeCon has worked diligently to always provide a safe and welcoming environment for all of our members. In the interest of further promoting safety for the FanimeCon community, access to the second floor of the convention center will require a FanimeCon Badge.

Some Key Benefits to this policy change:
Some Major Changes:
We thank you all in advance for your patience and understanding as we implement this new initiative. We welcome any and all feedback as we all come together to make this upcoming year another amazing and successful FanimeCon!

For more information and updates please refer to the FanimeCon webpage:
http://www.fanime.com/csi/ (http://www.fanime.com/csi/)
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members
Post by: Kyra_Maverick on April 07, 2016, 12:21:42 PM
Will badge check stations be located on the map as well? I'm mostly curious about the hotels connected to the con and the potential bottlenecking that will happen in an already congested area.

Otherwise this sounds like a decent way to streamline entry into other crowded areas like dealers hall and artist alley.
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members
Post by: Konekogami on April 07, 2016, 12:55:53 PM
I love this.  No really, I absolutely LOVE this. 

As someone who gets regularly creeped on by drunk people who you can tell that they're not Fanime Attendees and are just there to snap some pics, make lewd comments and laugh at people. 

I love this.

o3o A+
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members
Post by: Nina Star 9 on April 07, 2016, 02:08:31 PM
Interesting.

Hopefully this doesn't cause more problems.

Though we all know that it's to prevent ghosting. ;] Hopefully it helps with late-night safety issues, though. (I've had plenty of creepers who are con attendees, though, so idk)

Are badges going to be checked all night as well as during the day? And are obviously drunk people (even with badges) going to be turned away?
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: Barnes on April 07, 2016, 03:03:18 PM
Now that I think about it, I found it strange that I (and everyone else) could walk upstairs easily, because there were no badge checkpoints for the main area.

I hope this new plan works out well.
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: TC_X0_Lt_0X on April 07, 2016, 05:08:56 PM
I was worried that this was going to be some stupid SJW safety policy or something.

I guess my main concern is how this is going to effect traffic into and out of the convention center. Many people wonder all over the place, and with food, panels and regular returns to hotel rooms, not to mention other events, I can see many people going to and from the convention center a dozen times a day or more even.

Im guessing the badge checks will be on the first floor correct? Otherwise I smell a death trap if we have lines going up all those stairs. I imagine those checkpoints that connect to the Hilton and Marriott are going to be difficult to deal with too sense it has 3 paths leading on to the 2nd floor converging right there. And how are elevators going to work out? Im sure they are going to be put off limits and reserved for handicap people, but then you are going to need to have someone on guard not only on the first floor but the parking garage too, unless you can shut down floors the elevator can land on. Even then though.
The real question though is if those lines are going to move fast enough and if their will be enough entry points to get people in in a timely manner. From a generic convention center map, I count about 7 or so entry points, with traffic likely passing though the front and hotel entries the most. And those entry points will need to have corresponding exit points too, probably cutting potential traffic in half.

I guess sense their will be constant flow through the entry points that it will thin out naturally over time, but I am a little worried about that friday morning line.

I also imagine that the fairmont hotel is going to be the usual setup with someone checking badges at doors yeah? While there will be few, I am sure their will be other guests at the fairmont besides congoers that will have to have access to the 2nd floor, unless they are forced to take alternate paths to their rooms. Probably wouldn't be an issue one way or the other there, ghosts aren't going to host around panel rooms, there is not much happening over there. They will still have the first floor and outside areas though.
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: Angelx624 on April 07, 2016, 06:59:52 PM
Well, I can see this as a good thing. It means it should be less crowded on the second floor, now. More room to roam around freely, I hope. And it will feel nice knowing that there won't be creepy non con-goers on the second floor. (^^)"
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: Ecchi ja Nai on April 07, 2016, 07:23:55 PM
Did anyone else happen to attend the recent Silicon Valley Comic Con?  It was also held at the SJCC and they had a similar policy where you would tap in/out with their NFC/RFID bracelet to gain access to most of the con.  In fact, when I first read the OP, my immediate thought was that someone from staff had attended and noticed that they didn't need to check badges at every entrance to the panels or Dealers Hall or the like, and thought that it would work well for Fanime too.

It was great in theory.  People would be able to move in and out of the different halls and rooms once they showed proof of registration at a central area.  There were a couple of problems with this, though.  They had a bunch of things going on both upstairs and at the ground floor of the convention center.  Due to their schedule and the different panels I was interested in, there was a lot of tapping in and out to get from one area to another.  The other issue stemmed from the fact that the badge/wristband check was set up basically at the top of the main stairs in front of one of the large halls - I think it was Hall 2 - set roughly where Stage Zero normally is but further back closer to the middle of that area.  While the tap in/out process was very fast, the sheer number of people and the layout of the second floor made that a major bottleneck.  In all they maybe had a couple dozen stations set up, of which only three or four were positioned as an exit.  All of them were in the same general area, so that quickly got clogged with a ton of people trying to work their way both out of the area and further in to where everything was happening.  It didn't help that SVCC apparently drew the largest crowd ever for the convention center, but it really didn't look like there were that many more people than the past few Fanimes.  What SVCC didn't have was anything going on in any of the SJCC side rooms or any of the hotel ballrooms.  Originally I was thinking Fanime would have badge check at the entrances on the main floor, but then I remembered you can access everything by coming in from the hotels, and there are all those entrances from the convention center garage as well.  I'm assuming Fanime is keeping their policy of having those side panel and viewing rooms requiring a badge to get in to, so I guess those locations will still need people checking badges at the door.

I really want this to work out as this would free up a TON of staff and volunteers from having to just sit there for hours checking badges, and I know they could always use that help in some other capacity around the con.  However, knowing how spread out Fanime is and witnessing how poorly it worked for Comic Con I'm just not convinced we'll see a positive outcome.  I'm all for changes to the con with the hopes of improving things for both staff and attendees.  I guess we'll just have to hope there's a good game plan behind all this and see how things wind up. 
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: tesla on April 07, 2016, 11:15:39 PM
Since Fanime badges dont have the tap in/out that SVCC had, [yes I did attend and volunteer, was AMAZING!! :)] it sounds like it will just be a jumbo badge checking station at all the 2nd floor access points. That is a lot of places, maybe some will get blocked? In theory it would be faster than SVCC because eyes are faster than tech. It'll be interesting to see if any of the big attractions (ie reg, artist's alley, dealer's hall) will have to adjust to this implementation. They would be hard to move/adjust simply because they need a lot of space to be efficient. 
I know AX has a similar system with bag checks (after the bomb threat a few years ago) when you enter and badge checks on their second floor. It slowed down entering the con a little, but they were very efficient. Maybe this will encourage more peeps to buy badges if they just want to lurk in the upper hallways!
Fanime is wonderful and happy and awesome, so I hope this will help it stay that way!! :)
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: InsaneDavid on April 08, 2016, 12:31:35 PM
In theory it would be faster than SVCC because eyes are faster than tech. It'll be interesting to see if any of the big attractions (ie reg, artist's alley, dealer's hall) will have to adjust to this implementation. They would be hard to move/adjust simply because they need a lot of space to be efficient.

I assume it would be faster as it would be a "check, wave - check, wave - check, wave" process.  I'd also assume / hope there would still be entrance / exit traffic controls at the dealer's hall, artist's alley, etc. but of course that depends on how the layout changes this year.  I could see there still being a queue to get into the attraction rooms such as the dealer's hall, but there to automatically regulate entrance speed and keep it moving smoothly.
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: Misamo on April 13, 2016, 09:21:40 PM
I saw this idea used at SacAnime to get up to the second floor!  I thought it was a pretty nice idea since that meant upstairs did thankfully had a whole lot less people and yes I know it is smaller then Fanime but it was something that I liked and I'm glad the staff is going to try it for Fanime this year!

Just thought about this when I was looking through the forums:  To make things easier I think that 18+ attendees should have a different color wristband or something like that to make it easier for the panels younger ones aren't supposed to get into.  Just a suggestion that may make things a bit easier on everyone!
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: TC_X0_Lt_0X on April 13, 2016, 10:50:37 PM
Just thought about this when I was looking through the forums:  To make things easier I think that 18+ attendees should have a different color wristband or something like that to make it easier for the panels younger ones aren't supposed to get into.  Just a suggestion that may make things a bit easier on everyone!

This has been suggested earlier this year down in the serious business section. To save my typing, ill just quote myself.

Im not sure if there is a viable means to verify an age though. If memory serves correctly, in registration you can just put any age effectively, and the age entry is a age range even. I suppose verification can be done at badge pickup, but that might slow it down a bit and cause conflict, especially with group registration where most of the group wont be around to verify their ages. I think most importantly though, if you are going to mark age on badges, there might be an expectation that a badge marked for a certain age can be used in place of showing ID, and with that there could be an issue with people trading their badges to underage congoers. And if thats not allowed, then Im sure a lot of people are going to be wondering why it is being implemented at all.

These aren't all huge issues and can probably be remedied easily enough, but in the long run Im not sure if is all that worth dealing with either. I think it might just be easier to ask how old they are. You can be indirect about it and ask them where they are taking classes, where they work, or if they drink or something as well easy enough. Its all easy to lie about no doubt, but not any less then it is to lie to registration.


strike through with the irrelevant bits.
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: MyAlterEg0 on April 17, 2016, 07:12:29 PM
Misamo wrote "Just thought about this when I was looking through the forums:  To make things easier I think that 18+ attendees should have a different color wristband or something like that to make it easier for the panels younger ones aren't supposed to get into.  Just a suggestion that may make things a bit easier on everyone!"

and
TC_X0_Lt_0X wrote "Im not sure if there is a viable means to verify an age though. If memory serves correctly, in registration you can just put any age effectively, and the age entry is a age range even. I suppose verification can be done at badge pickup, but that might slow it down a bit and cause conflict, especially with group registration where most of the group wont be around to verify their ages. I think most importantly though, if you are going to mark age on badges, there might be an expectation that a badge marked for a certain age can be used in place of showing ID, and with that there could be an issue with people trading their badges to underage congoers. And if thats not allowed, then Im sure a lot of people are going to be wondering why it is being implemented at all."

and I write:

This is ridiculous.  The bottleneck caused in registration would be horrendous!  This would effectively remove any benefit of group pickups.  The wristband or different badge is not effective.  People already share badges and can swap wristbands.  If a minor has an adult badge goes into Hentai, think of the repurcusions.
Criminal charges could be pressed (and someone will go to jail).
The con could be sued.
This jeapordizes not only the attraction, but the event (con) itself.

or

Say somebody decides to hook up with someone that has an adult badge, but is a minor.  The person is then in trouble by making the wrong assumption that they were old enough, and it possibly places the con in a precarious legal position.
The alternative? People wearing their government issued ID <- This is illegal, an invasion of privacy, and goes against the principals of the promoting safety.
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: TC_X0_Lt_0X on April 18, 2016, 05:53:20 AM
Wait are you disagreeing with me? I dont know but the way your post is structured seems to be indicating that is the case, even though I agree with you and I think my posts agrees with you as well.
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: Angelx624 on April 18, 2016, 06:10:07 PM
Fanime's never even had wristbands to begin with. You're probably getting it confused with Sac-Anime. :) Just a heads up. ^^
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: MyAlterEg0 on April 18, 2016, 07:00:45 PM
Wait are you disagreeing with me? I dont know but the way your post is structured seems to be indicating that is the case, even though I agree with you and I think my posts agrees with you as well.

LOL, nope,  you're right... we are in complete agreement.

just explaining it further....like to add the clarify the money factor:

considering a bulk price (at 5+) of $49/500 with a daily need of ~40k at a cost of $3920 Plus tax/shipping (couple hundred), I fail to see the beneift of spending $16k on something that isn't effective...that could probably pay for 2 guests of honors...
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: Firefury Amahira on May 12, 2016, 02:01:00 AM
I don't really think that carding 18+ panels at the door is going to create enough of a bottleneck to justify special measures to indicate the 18+ attendees, honestly. Those events are all later in the evening, generally at times the con's crowding and intensity level drops off considerably compared to prime time hours. Between the lower crowd levels and there generally not being tons and tons of 18+ only panels, they can probably keep carding folks at the door to those panels. I imagine they'll still need a staffer at the doors anyway for usual tasks of notifying panelists when time's up (and in case there are problems, like the drunk attendees at the 18+ Fanfic 369 panel a year or two back that con staff had to kick out,) so whoever's on door duty can handle checking IDs.

As others have already pointed out, trying to card people at reg has serious drawbacks, especially for group pickup. Wristbands or other special 18+ markers are just an unnecessary and inefficient expense, especially compared to just having a staffer who's going to have to be at the door to a panel anyway handle the ID check on the way into the room. At least unlike in years past, they won't also have to be checking badges, just IDs.
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: .3mm on February 02, 2017, 05:56:48 PM
do you think it is safe to leave children here unattended by adults? or would it be better for them to have adult supervision?
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: TC_X0_Lt_0X on February 03, 2017, 12:23:01 PM
What ages are we talking about?
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: InsaneDavid on February 03, 2017, 01:45:13 PM
What ages are we talking about?

That's the key.  The San Jose McEnery Convention Center is a large facility and Fanime events and attendees sprawl out over much of the surrounding area as well, with tens of thousands of people at the convention and the surrounding downtown area over the course of the weekend.
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: .3mm on February 03, 2017, 03:09:51 PM
early teens
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: Nina Star 9 on February 03, 2017, 06:00:11 PM
This answer will change based on whether the teens will be there late/have a hotel room or whether they will just be there during the day.

If the teens are going to be there during the day and picked up in the evening, I'd give a cautious yes to being unsupervised, but having at the very least an older teen in the group would be best. If we're talking 12 and 13 or so, supervision would be best. If we're talking 15 or 16 or so, they can probably handle themselves. Set ground rules, such as having to stay in a group, not going outside of designated con areas (walking to the Fairmont and back or going to a gathering in the park should be safe, but wandering around DTSJ might not be) or otherwise designated areas, and/or having to inform someone whenever leaving the con premises with where they are going and checking in when they get there and come back.

If the teens are going to have a hotel room, have an adult there. It's a 24-hour con. Lots of people have parties and alcohol. Walking to restaurants around the area is generally fine during the day (and con goers are usually everywhere during con and pretty good and looking out for people), but can get sketchy at night. Even if you trust the teens to not get into any mischief (which does happen since cons tend to lower inhibitions for everyone but especially teens), there's no guarantee that someone else isn't going to get them into mischief.

Generally, the con itself (as in, inside the convention center) is pretty safe, especially during the daytime. I can't imagine them getting into too much trouble there, especially since teens tend to stick together at cons, and tend to group up by fandom. ("The con itself" does cover a large area, though, as pointed out earlier.) Unless they somehow run in with the wrong crowd or have an unfortunate experience with someone creepy, they'll likely be fine as long as they are generally well-behaved. Really, the worst that generally happens with young teens at cons is that they get a bit rowdy and overexcited and may look back in 10 years and cringe a little. It's not safe enough to leave someone as young as 12 or 13 there without at least an older teen with them, though, I'd think, especially since they may not be mature enough or have enough life experience to make good decisions, and may be overly trusting or naive.

When I was much younger and attending this con, that was many years ago when the scene was different and the con was much smaller. Generally, the rule that my parents had was that my sister (older by ~2 years) and I had to stick together, and we couldn't leave the con itself without a parent with us. I'd say that's a pretty decent rule these days, too, now that there's more people.

Also, while older people at cons will often look out for those who are younger when needed, we're not babysitters and don't always want the responsibility of keeping someone else's kids safe. I had an experience once where I was running an off-site event at night (we got back to the con around 10PM and walked several blocks to a dinner location) and found out /once we got there/ that some of the people in the group were as young as 12 and had no adult supervision. Even the oldest person in that group of people was around 14. I was pretty sketched out that there were such young people at an off-site nighttime event run by a grown-ass adult stranger with no supervision whatsoever, and was super thankful that I was the one running the event and not a predator of some type, and that the kids were relatively well-behaved. (I made the events 21+ after that!)

So I'd say that if the kids are old enough to take care of themselves, it would be okay if they were there during the day, but proceed with caution. If they're going to be there at night or overnight, adult supervision is a must.

And really, if the teens are old enough, supervision doesn't have to be that a parent is there by their side the whole time as long as you make sure they stay in a group and check in occasionally. You can always hit up the hotel bar, the pool, the Tech museum down the street, catch a  movie, find fans closer to your age, etc., and still be nearby enough to check on them or go with them places offsite, so it doesn't feel like "ugh, mom/dad has to hover around me all day" for them, and it doesn't feel like "oh my god I'm so old why am I here" for you.

So in a nutshell: during the day, onsite only? Maybe, if the teens are especially mature, but I'd lean towards no. Much better if there's at least an older teen in the group.
During the day, offsite? A little iffy, so be sure to have at least one older person in the group and have them check in with someone else when leaving the con center itself.
At night? Hard no. Have an adult there.

Of course, different people will have different opinions on this, and it depends a lot on the kids themselves. About the youngest that I'd be comfortable with letting go free at the con without supervision of someone older is 16, but I'd still make sure they had someone older around at night. 13 is too young, especially if there is only one teen or if there are multiple teens who tend to have the effect of creating peer pressure and lowering inhibitions or the ability to say no, or that ramp up and create so much excitement with each other that they may not notice danger.
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: Admiral Donuts on February 03, 2017, 07:40:50 PM
do you think it is safe to leave children here unattended by adults? or would it be better for them to have adult supervision?

...who's leaving children unattended?
Title: Re: ~IMPORTANT~ A Message to our Members - Convention Safety Initiative
Post by: .3mm on February 04, 2017, 08:43:34 AM
okay, thank you :D