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Author Topic: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.  (Read 30651 times)

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kamehitsu

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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #20 on: December 02, 2007, 03:03:04 PM »

i was planning on making a few t-shirts and stuff like that in my art class to sell at fanime for about 8-14$ each and i'll be making stencils and w/e myself, i wondering if it counts as a rip off or counterfeit if i do (it's not like i'm selling them as geniune) i'll just be selling to regain money i spent to enter :P
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KamijoIsLove

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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #21 on: December 12, 2007, 10:01:48 AM »

Ooh, on the subject of bootlegs.

There's that guy that seems to be at every con I've been to (a total of two LOL), but...well, he sells JRock merchandise and prints and such.

I mean, he sells 'em cheap, and they're obviously all homemade, since I recognized many of the pictures as scans from like, PatiPati, or What's In?, and Cure, and Shoxx, and yeah. I bought a Hyde print that I recognized from What's In? for like...twenty bucks. >_< It was shiny. I had to buy it.

But does that count as 'bootlegging?' That guy's smart; he's the only guy that sells JRock merchandise in a sea of anime stuffs, so...he's the only guy to go to. xD ;;No competition. Yeah...

That's just about the prints. His CD's, DVD's, and photobooks all looked authentic to me, so yeah.
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FanFicGuru

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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #22 on: January 14, 2008, 04:13:02 PM »

i was planning on making a few t-shirts and stuff like that in my art class to sell at fanime for about 8-14$ each and i'll be making stencils and w/e myself, i wondering if it counts as a rip off or counterfeit if i do (it's not like i'm selling them as geniune) i'll just be selling to regain money i spent to enter :P

If the art and images that are on the shirts are your creations that you used your own money and resources to make, there shouldn't be any problem with selling them.

It's when you use shopped images from anime/RPGs...slap them on a shirt and sell them for 10 dollars that it becomes an issue.

I wouldn't worry about it too much.
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migitlicious

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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #23 on: March 30, 2008, 04:36:45 AM »

What about wall scrolls? I was planning on finding some at fanime this year and I wonder if those are subjected to counterfeiting as well. I already have some but never thought about how to distinguish a real one from a fake one.
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Keys

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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #24 on: April 02, 2008, 05:45:46 PM »

What about wall scrolls? I was planning on finding some at fanime this year and I wonder if those are subjected to counterfeiting as well. I already have some but never thought about how to distinguish a real one from a fake one.

There is heavy bootlegging on wall scrolls. 

One way to be sure yours is legit is to see if it has copyright information on it.  You'll notice that the domestic ones produced by Great Eastern all have the name of the series and copyright information right there on the image.

Signs that a wallscroll is bootlegged include but are not limited to: cut-off/cropped off words, cut-off/cropped off characters/character parts/hair, low print quality (I saw one last year that was very splotchy and have heard there is a lot of speckling), and poor image quality (blurred, at an angle, aliasing)

Really to be sure, I would look for the copyright information.
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Keys

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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #25 on: April 02, 2008, 05:53:59 PM »

To get a legit Ghibli item, just check for the Miyazaki copy right.  If it is there along with the other stickers, it should be good.  Once again, research plays a huge role.

Cells, are extremely hard to make sure of.  I have been told legit cells have the following:

1. Good cells usually are drawn rougher.  Remember, they work fast, their work won't be perfect.

2. It comes with a sketch of the cell to prove the cell came from the same artist.

3. It has a Letter of authenticity.

But for cells, this still is not guarantee you a legit item.  Just exercise caution, do your research, and make sure you buy from those with excellent reputations.

dealerjason

Well, anyone can make a letter of authenticity and some anime series tend to have cels released without sketches.  Furthermore, while I have plenty of cels with errors, I've never found the work to look sloppier on average than a fan done work.

I actually have a somewhat lengthy answer to the question of cel authenticity here: http://www.fukushuu.org/cels/faqitem.php?g=y&cf=91
The short of it:
- Buy from dealers you trust.  Not only are they less likely to have gotten a fake, if by chance they do, they'll give you a refund if you can show it isn't genuine. 
- A lot of cels aren't worth it to fake.  It's a lot of effort and supplies to fake a $50 cel when you  could be faking a $500 one.
- Check your cel versus the scene it comes from in the anime.  This may take some time to find.  Do the lines match up?  Do the flaws match up?  If the  sequence number is low does it come  early in the cut?  On the off chance you find the cel is fake, if you bought from a reputable dealer, you can get a refund.
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Keys

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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #26 on: April 02, 2008, 05:58:29 PM »

I've generally found this page to be a good starting point on the issue of bootlegs:
http://www.digital.anime.org.uk/piratefaq.html
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Pika1979

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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #27 on: May 08, 2008, 01:01:56 PM »

here is the one really good advice i can give you about buying anything and this goes for the dealers room as well as swap meet. if it dose not look right don't buy it. you all know what i mean. i have been to flea markets and seen this stuff. DBZ figures with the wrong color clothing, DVDs that have the badly blurred  covers, and CDs that have English lyrics for a j-rock band. so just remember look at what your buying. and just on a side note about bootleg DVDs i will admit that I have bought bootlegged items before. but as soon as it was available in the US i bought it.
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Varnado Barolius

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Re: Dealer Room
« Reply #28 on: June 04, 2008, 01:17:21 AM »

Can anyone tell me why the dealer room seems to get smaller and smaller? i this is my third year going and the dealer room was so small this year.

Mzre Yuen @ TaoToys booth
There were more dealers than last year, but less diversity of what they were selling.

I'd also like to say prices were higher, but prices are always too high for everything when you're a student. ;)
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sky-chan

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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #29 on: December 01, 2008, 11:00:28 PM »

I understand the concern about bootlegs, though I've had the pleasure of avoiding them completely in the two years I've been attending Fanime. I guess being very picky until the nice people in the Bandai or Funimation booths attack you is a good thing. XD They got me my first year, and I HAD to buy a Black Cat DVD just for the XIII tattoo that came inside. Because of that, I had to take the train back and grab snacks in order to make it through the rest of the con. I'm such a dork. XD;
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frumpy

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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #30 on: April 06, 2009, 03:14:42 AM »

If anyone has suspicions that some of the products are bootlegs, feel free to drop by the FanimeCon Dealers Dept booth. We strive to ensure that no one gets ripped off by any dealer. All dealers should realize by now that we do not tolerate bootlegs anymore. And like it was mentioned in previous posts, RESEARCH IS THE KEY! I've been fortunate enough to work with various dealers who've taught me how to spot bootlegs. Also, just because a Dealer claims an item is real, doesn't necessarily mean it is legit. Believe it or not, there are some Dealers who just don't know any better & will get ripped off by their wholesalers. (Wholesalers will claim their products are legit!)

Things to be weary of:

-Plushies of All Sizes - Bleach, Naruto, One Piece, Prince of Tennis, Sgt Frog, Studio Ghibli (mostly Totoro), Dragon Ball Z, Deathnote, Nintendo, Tsubasa's Mokona, etc. Tags AND stickers of approval have been copied. Make sure the cloth tags spell "made in xxxxx" correctly. I've caught some tags with "Mad in China". Fake cardboard tags will look pixelated compared to the real tags. Depending on the real companies, tags will sometimes have a gloss or not. Recent Ghibli bootlegs will have a smooth gloss, but SOME of the real tags will have a matte, non-gloss rough paper texture feel upon touching it.

-Boxed Gashapon - SquarEnix's Final Fantasy (ALL series), Kingdom Hearts, Fullmetal Alchemist. MOST boxed gashapon are usually sealed by glue (and sometimes feature a pull-zip to open the box from the top). I've noticed that the fakes will are sealed with tape on top & bottom. However, there ARE few real items that are sealed w/ tape, but not many...

-PVC Statues - Various statues made by Good Smile has been heavily bootlegged, try to keep an eye out for their holofoil sticker of approval. Megahouse's Bleach (and other various titles) PVC's have been heavily bootlegged also. (fake Ichigo's box will have Rukia's name written in Japanese.) Again, look for the "studio pierrot" sticker of approval, but make sure the sticker is real - it's a deep blue, solid color. The fake stickers look a bit washed out and is off-center on the cut.

-Jewelry & Cosplay Items - ALL Final Fantasy items are not meant to be cheap. If you can get a necklace for $20, I'd highly question the authenticity of it. Naruto headbands are officially released by GE for North America. Bootleg headbands may or may not have the "studio pierrot" fake sticker.

-Misc Items - ALL Deathnote Notebooks are fake. Those are from H.K. and are generally packaged in a brown box for presentation.

Here's some dealers who I can definitely trust for legit items shipped straight from Japan:

-AnimeJungle - gashapon, PVC statues
-AnimePalace - plushies (and many other items)
-JPN Toys - plush & PVC figurines
-Wizzy Wig - video game related toys & plush
-Cards & Comics Central - PVC, action figures, gashapon, some plush
-Nikaku Mart - various toys & figures
-Toys Logic - PVC statues & action figures

If you're someone who's knowledgable on bootlegs and would like to be on Dealer's Staff, please PM me! I can always use an extra pair of eyes.  ;D
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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #31 on: November 02, 2009, 04:39:32 PM »

Haha #3 happened to me and my group last year. We were buying the prop plus petite code geass figurines, the chibi ones, and we bought them for $8 when we walked around a bit more we saw this lady selling the exact ones for $2! We bought more from that lady for cheaper.
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frumpy

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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #32 on: November 20, 2009, 07:53:25 PM »

Haha #3 happened to me and my group last year. We were buying the prop plus petite code geass figurines, the chibi ones, and we bought them for $8 when we walked around a bit more we saw this lady selling the exact ones for $2! We bought more from that lady for cheaper.

Ah...but were you able to tell the difference in quality?? The figures can look the same, but the paint quality will be slightly off color or a little messy. The box/packaging print wouldn't look as sharp and pixelated as well....
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Camilla Wong
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kimonomomo

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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #33 on: March 22, 2010, 04:30:18 PM »

I bought a Japanese DVD online through Amazon... and it was a *bleeping* bootleg. The quality is poor, it won't last through too many viewings, and I've supported a parasite. But I couldn't tell online and I was anxious to grab a copy of the film when I could. At a show you can handle the case and look close enough to tell if the image on the cover is a copy or looks original.

frumpy

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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #34 on: March 28, 2010, 03:54:26 AM »

I bought a Japanese DVD online through Amazon... and it was a *bleeping* bootleg. The quality is poor, it won't last through too many viewings, and I've supported a parasite. But I couldn't tell online and I was anxious to grab a copy of the film when I could. At a show you can handle the case and look close enough to tell if the image on the cover is a copy or looks original.

Unfortunately, Amazon & eBay is like a giant flea market. The contracted vendors who sell thru Amazon aren't policed for bootlegs.  :-[
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dburr

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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #35 on: May 19, 2010, 03:59:43 PM »

Some very useful information on how to spot the bootlegs can be found at the Pirate Anime FAQ.  Looks like it hasn't been updated since 2008, but still quite a bit of useful information there.
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cutiebunny

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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #36 on: August 10, 2010, 03:36:57 AM »

To get a legit Ghibli item, just check for the Miyazaki copy right.  If it is there along with the other stickers, it should be good.  Once again, research plays a huge role.

Cells, are extremely hard to make sure of.  I have been told legit cells have the following:

1. Good cells usually are drawn rougher.  Remember, they work fast, their work won't be perfect.

2. It comes with a sketch of the cell to prove the cell came from the same artist.

3. It has a Letter of authenticity.

But for cells, this still is not guarantee you a legit item.  Just exercise caution, do your research, and make sure you buy from those with excellent reputations.

dealerjason

 ::)

First of all, it's 'cels'.  C-E-L-S.

If you're out to buy cels, there are two key components to look for - registration holes and sequence numbers.  Registration holes are important; they were used to keep the cel in place while the camera took the picture.  They should be uniformly cut with two elongated spheres on either side & one circle hole in the middle.  They will all be uniformly lined up.  Generally, registration holes appear on the top of the cel, but, ocassionally, they will appear on the bottom.  Also, there are situations where a cel has been trimmed(either by the studio or a previous owner).  

Sequence numbers typically appear on the right hand side of the registration.  It generally includes a number and a letter, like, A-1.  Sometimes, there are words along with it, such as 'END' and 'TOME'.  These mean different things, and it's probably best that you head to a cel forum(like Anime-Beta) for more info.

Sketches are a whole different matter.  Most of the sketches that come with cels are not rough sketches.  They are exact matches to what you see on the cel.  That's because these sketches, known commonly as douga, were those that were used to make the xerox lines for the cel.  Occasionally, you'll find cels that also come with the roughs, known as genga.      


"Good cels" will never appear rough.  Remember, this cel appeared in anime.  Minus lighting and special effectts & this picture should appear exactly as it did on TV/DVD.  Also, the chances of you knowing the name of the person who drew the sketch(the cel was painted by another person, sometimes in another country) is slim.  That's because most artists never marked their work.  Each anime consisted of several key animators & lots of in-betweeners. 

Most anime cels do NOT have authenticity letters.  Nor are they stamped by the studio; Studio Pierrot & AIC are the only ones I know of that stamped cels.  So, you'll occasionally see some Tenchi Muyo & Tenshi ni  Narumon cels with stamps.  Most cels are just by themselves, sometimes with a douga, and sometimes with a background(and most of the time, they aren't matching backgrounds).  Authenticity letters are more frequent with US animation items.

There are other things to look for, such as line fading with Toei cels, but, that does take quite a bit more experience.  Once again, if you're looking to buy cels, head to a place where people collect cels.  Familiarize yourself with the common features before you buy.

I don't recall seeing anyone selling fancels in the dealers' hall this year.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2010, 03:44:04 AM by cutiebunny »
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Akito_starwind

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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #37 on: August 10, 2010, 04:51:28 PM »

Thax for the great info.
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Persona

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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #38 on: March 18, 2011, 10:20:17 AM »

Old topic, but I just want to jump in on the PVC figure bootlegs. PVC has become hotter and hotter these days, which means that quality and prices have gone up as well as bootlegged copies of the most popular figures. Most seasoned collectors will already know what to look for, but if you're planning on starting or just want one or two to adorn your work/playspace, here are some tips:

1. Easiest thing to do first is to check the box. Usually bootlegged figures have awful printed boxes -- the color is too contrasted, the words are blurred or wrong (if you can read Japanese, but sometimes the English is wrong as well), and the box itself feels too matte or scratchy.

2. Looking at the prism stickers of authenticity is helpful as well, but most beginners will probably not be able to tell the difference between an artfully printed fake and a real hologram sticker, especially if they haven't really looked at the two side by side. Think of a well-made fake brand purse -- if you don't own a real one, you're probably not going to know where to look for signs of fakeness.

3. If the above checks out or is really hard to tell, look at the figure itself. Is the paint job sloppy? Do the eyes look weird? Is everything just a shade or two off from what you know the figure or character to look like? These features are especially apparent in Nendoroids and figmas, both of which are heavily bootlegged in China and can sometimes be super close to the real thing.

4. If you've fallen prey to fakes, there are two very obvious ways you can tell. First is general quality -- the figure may not even stand up or fit together correctly in places, even if the paint job looks fine. This is the fault of the cheaper plastic/old molds that the bootleggers use. Secondly, the smell. Fakes smell AWFUL. PVC in general doesn't smell like a walk through a rose garden, but fakes give off an awful chemical smell, especially the lower quality fakes.

If the dealer you bought them from looks trustworthy, let them know that they carry fakes and that they're being ripped off by their supplier. If they look like they don't care and are knowingly selling fakes at authentic prices, let everyone else know, especially ops or rovers.

The best way to protect yourself is to do extensive research on the figure(s) you want, online or otherwise. Know exactly how they look, especially the little details (trim, eyes, clear vs opaque), and you'll probably do alright.
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zeroelement

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Re: Ways to protect yourself while buying at Fanime.
« Reply #39 on: May 19, 2011, 08:03:39 PM »

On the topic of bootlegs Please note that some Anime companies are going out of business do to influx of people getting bootlegs(an fansubs TT_TT ) Last i heard Funimation is close to declaring bankrupt
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