What's Banned at FanimeCon and what's not banned...

[luckyends]

i have been reading this thread and looking around on the forum boards for a while now and reading things and sorry to say i dont mean to be atacking a specific person but the thing that brought me into these debates was the fact that pyonikari posted a thread that was about signs being baned which was later to be noted untrue and also the fact that he posted a large post about how a viedo of glomps made by a girl who went around glomping people he said this was completly unaceptable
sry if that was kinda rambaly but im not good at typing but in defence for that video she showed (for the most part) the proper way to glomp some one which was to shout out there name giving them 10 seconds warning to tell her no and then glomped ( i was one of the people)

ok any way
so my points are i agree with the idea of having general rules posted on the TV and in the play book about glomping and signage because half the people at fanime arnt on the boards reading these posts are doing the glomping and signage so if you were to put a page in the book or a peice of paper or something on the TV about proper forms of conduct on those 2 subjects that would solve alot of problems

sorry if i made no contribution to this thread -_-

[Xeluu]

Hi Xeluu, yeah, you're right, it needs to be up on the web site and that's something I've passed along, hopefully in the near future.

That's all I can reasonably ask for. Thank you for taking it into consideration and forwarding it to the appropriate staff.

*bow*

...
sry if that was kinda rambaly but im not good at typing but in defence for that video she showed (for the most part) the proper way to glomp some one which was to shout out there name giving them 10 seconds warning to tell her no and then glomped ( i was one of the people)
...
sorry if i made no contribution to this thread -_-

The only thing I don't particularly agree with is the fact that you should just shout their name before glomping them. Just ask. It takes... what, five seconds? Makes everyone happier too.

And everyone has a right to say something on the boards (assuming it's not flaming), so your opinion is, in my opinion, a contribution.

[quantbits]

Glomping is not a problem?

Some fat guy picked me up three time and didn't let me down. I almost hit my head on the floor.
Hard Gay is not for glomping, he's for taking pictures with, and the occasional UFO.

I found this extremely annoying last year, I'd just get tackled randomly.

I hope the rovers enforce this, because I'm more than willing to enforce this myself verbally in a firm non-HG style without any cursing with no regret.
No touch unless I let you. That right belongs to my friends, and no one else.

PS.
No, DON'T tell me it's because I'm Hard Gay that I deserved it, because I didn't harass anyone at the con without permission because I respected THEIR privacy.
I demand my respect in return, and that means no glomping.

[PassingTheBuck]

Glomping is not a problem?

Some fat guy picked me up three time and didn't let me down. I almost hit my head on the floor.
Hard Gay is not for glomping, he's for taking pictures with, and the occasional UFO.

I found this extremely annoying last year, I'd just get tackled randomly.

I hope the rovers enforce this, because I'm more than willing to enforce this myself verbally in a firm non-HG style without any cursing with no regret.
No touch unless I let you. That right belongs to my friends, and no one else.

PS.
No, DON'T tell me it's because I'm Hard Gay that I deserved it, because I didn't harass anyone at the con without permission because I respected THEIR privacy.
I demand my respect in return, and that means no glomping.

Hi quantbits, sorry you have such a bad interaction with the Glompers, there are a few bad apples out there and yes, they need to be educated and my I suggest using a 'clue-by-four' and verbally telling them what they have done wrong.  If that doesn't work, get their name, if you see a Rover/Safety patrol, let them know about it, if you don't see a partol, come to ConOps and make a report.  If nothing else, get the name and badge number.

I agree with you that you have the right to not be physically abuse by someone 'glomping' you, especially if it creeps you out.

Craige...

[PyronIkari]

Ah... enter "I am going to be respectable authoritarian figure mode".

Now we get into the issue of. Will the con actually do anything.

Here's how I see it. Let's say quantbits goes through the trouble of getting the persons name, and badge number by some how magically forcing them to give it to him. Now, he takes 10-20 minutes to go to con-ops, makes a report gives them the badge name and number.

What is the con going to do about it?

Essentially THIS is how it gets impossible for the con to enforce because there's no way the con can go "ALRIGHT, we will find person xxxxx with badge number yyyy and do something about it!" Unless the person does it like 10 times, and all 10 times the person is reported, it's a waste of time to even attempt to go look for the person.

Based on this, there is no threat to people that do it. Let's say He verbally warned this person "you can't do this, this is invasion of my privacy and battery blah blah blah blah". They'll just go "lighten up it's just part of the con spirit" and run off.

Hence why there needs to be an established rule on the matter made by the con and made aware. So if they do it you can go THIS IS AGAINST CON RULES... which carries a much stronger impact than "You shouldn't do this". A lot of people won't like it, but a lot of people won't like any rule that allows less freedoms. If the rule makes logical sense to prevent major problems though, they'll have to deal with it.

[Stormfalcon]

I agree with you that you have the right to not be physically abuse by someone 'glomping' you, especially if it creeps you out.

Craige...

And that's the point a number of us were trying to get across over the course of a half-dozen threads or so.  Some of us were feeling a lot of frustration, partly from the sense we were getting that FanimeCon wasn't taking the issue seriously at all and was content to leave it for the fans to sort out (of course, the other major source of frustration was from other posters who think it's perfectly a-okay to glomp people willy-nilly, permission or no, and wasn't about to take no for an answer).  The problem with that approach is that you're going to get people deciding to resolve things their own way, to the point of repaying the glomp with their own act of violence in some cases.  Unwanted glomping isn't good, and neither is attacking the glomper in retaliation.  That's why Fanime needs to make it known that it takes the matter seriously, before the matter gets even more out of hand.  Putting the code of conduct on the site (ideally linking it to registration to make sure people registering it at least give it a glance) and amending it to include matters like unwanted glomps and signs would be a good step, as would putting notices in the programs, overhead video screens, flyers, etc.  I realize that rover staff is stretched as-is, but some awareness and action from them would be helpful.

Yes, this is coming down on the fun of some folks, but the problem is that their fun is making Fanime a lot less enjoyable for a number of people.  People shouldn't have to worry if some random glomper is going to invade their space, make unwanted physical contact, or ruin their costume at any given moment.  Consensual glomps are fine, no one has a problem with that (unless they somehow create a hazard of some sort).  It's the unwanted ones that are the problem, and more and more people are wondering if anything is going to be done about them at all.

[PassingTheBuck]

Ah... enter "I am going to be respectable authoritarian figure mode".

Now we get into the issue of. Will the con actually do anything.

Here's how I see it. Let's say quantbits goes through the trouble of getting the persons name, and badge number by some how magically forcing them to give it to him. Now, he takes 10-20 minutes to go to con-ops, makes a report gives them the badge name and number.

What is the con going to do about it?

Essentially THIS is how it gets impossible for the con to enforce because there's no way the con can go "ALRIGHT, we will find person xxxxx with badge number yyyy and do something about it!" Unless the person does it like 10 times, and all 10 times the person is reported, it's a waste of time to even attempt to go look for the person.

Based on this, there is no threat to people that do it. Let's say He verbally warned this person "you can't do this, this is invasion of my privacy and battery blah blah blah blah". They'll just go "lighten up it's just part of the con spirit" and run off.

Hence why there needs to be an established rule on the matter made by the con and made aware. So if they do it you can go THIS IS AGAINST CON RULES... which carries a much stronger impact than "You shouldn't do this". A lot of people won't like it, but a lot of people won't like any rule that allows less freedoms. If the rule makes logical sense to prevent major problems though, they'll have to deal with it.

Your opinion is duly noted Pyronikari and I will pass your observations along to Staff.

As a side note, your knowledge of the inner works of FanimeCon is lacking.  Rovers/Safety and senior management have the right to pull anyone's badge for misconduct, the notice has been on the back of the convention badges for a while and it's in the Program Book too.  I've pulled badges in the past for a variety of reason (slapping a complete stranger, moving arcade equipment, stealing in the Dealer's Room, using the space between the escalators as a slide, etc.), I'll probably do it again this year.  R/S has the ability to pull the offenders badge once the report has been given and they find the person, but they also may choice to warn the offender not to repeat it again or they will be ejected.  More to the point, you mention that it's a waste of time reporting the offender, because the penalty wouldn't be great enough to make it worth while.  As you can see, that just not true.

The Staff is working on getting the message out about being a good glomper vs being a bad glomper and what happens if you are a bad glomper.

[PassingTheBuck]

Hi Stormfalcon

And that's the point a number of us were trying to get across over the course of a half-dozen threads or so.  Some of us were feeling a lot of frustration, partly from the sense we were getting that FanimeCon wasn't taking the issue seriously at all and was content to leave it for the fans to sort out (of course, the other major source of frustration was from other posters who think it's perfectly a-okay to glomp people willy-nilly, permission or no, and wasn't about to take no for an answer).  The problem with that approach is that you're going to get people deciding to resolve things their own way, to the point of repaying the glomp with their own act of violence in some cases.  Unwanted glomping isn't good, and neither is attacking the glomper in retaliation.  That's why Fanime needs to make it known that it takes the matter seriously, before the matter gets even more out of hand.  Putting the code of conduct on the site (ideally linking it to registration to make sure people registering it at least give it a glance) and amending it to include matters like unwanted glomps and signs would be a good step, as would putting notices in the programs, overhead video screens, flyers, etc.  I realize that rover staff is stretched as-is, but some awareness and action from them would be helpful.

Yes, this is coming down on the fun of some folks, but the problem is that their fun is making Fanime a lot less enjoyable for a number of people.  People shouldn't have to worry if some random glomper is going to invade their space, make unwanted physical contact, or ruin their costume at any given moment.  Consensual glomps are fine, no one has a problem with that (unless they somehow create a hazard of some sort).  It's the unwanted ones that are the problem, and more and more people are wondering if anything is going to be done about them at all.

Okay, you are not going to see me disagree with you.  In fact I do agree that the bad-Glompers need to remove from the rest of those who are good-Glompers.  The staff is reviewing the rules and how to get the message out to the masses prior and At-Con.  Certain staff and management personnel have the right to strip anyone of their badge and eject them from the property and we are not afraid to use it.  As you mention, Rovers/Safety is going to be stretch when they are doing their normal duties and stop everyone who they see getting Glomp to inquiry if it was permitted would be overloading them.  Hence the reason we need the attendees to step up and assist in ID'ing the bad-Glompers.  Does that make sense?

[Stormfalcon]

Hi Stormfalcon

And that's the point a number of us were trying to get across over the course of a half-dozen threads or so.  Some of us were feeling a lot of frustration, partly from the sense we were getting that FanimeCon wasn't taking the issue seriously at all and was content to leave it for the fans to sort out (of course, the other major source of frustration was from other posters who think it's perfectly a-okay to glomp people willy-nilly, permission or no, and wasn't about to take no for an answer).  The problem with that approach is that you're going to get people deciding to resolve things their own way, to the point of repaying the glomp with their own act of violence in some cases.  Unwanted glomping isn't good, and neither is attacking the glomper in retaliation.  That's why Fanime needs to make it known that it takes the matter seriously, before the matter gets even more out of hand.  Putting the code of conduct on the site (ideally linking it to registration to make sure people registering it at least give it a glance) and amending it to include matters like unwanted glomps and signs would be a good step, as would putting notices in the programs, overhead video screens, flyers, etc.  I realize that rover staff is stretched as-is, but some awareness and action from them would be helpful.

Yes, this is coming down on the fun of some folks, but the problem is that their fun is making Fanime a lot less enjoyable for a number of people.  People shouldn't have to worry if some random glomper is going to invade their space, make unwanted physical contact, or ruin their costume at any given moment.  Consensual glomps are fine, no one has a problem with that (unless they somehow create a hazard of some sort).  It's the unwanted ones that are the problem, and more and more people are wondering if anything is going to be done about them at all.

Okay, you are not going to see me disagree with you.  In fact I do agree that the bad-Glompers need to remove from the rest of those who are good-Glompers.  The staff is reviewing the rules and how to get the message out to the masses prior and At-Con.  Certain staff and management personnel have the right to strip anyone of their badge and eject them from the property and we are not afraid to use it.  As you mention, Rovers/Safety is going to be stretch when they are doing their normal duties and stop everyone who they see getting Glomp to inquiry if it was permitted would be overloading them.  Hence the reason we need the attendees to step up and assist in ID'ing the bad-Glompers.  Does that make sense?

Sure, I have no problem pointing out the unwanted glompers at all.  I hope more and more attendees point out them out as well, in fact.    I think we're finally getting to a more workable approach with what you outlined there, and I applaud that.

[quantbits]

good to know I have a ally =). I doubt it'll come down to that... I'm pretty convincing when I need to be ;D

Glomping is not a problem?

Some fat guy picked me up three time and didn't let me down. I almost hit my head on the floor.
Hard Gay is not for glomping, he's for taking pictures with, and the occasional UFO.

I found this extremely annoying last year, I'd just get tackled randomly.

I hope the rovers enforce this, because I'm more than willing to enforce this myself verbally in a firm non-HG style without any cursing with no regret.
No touch unless I let you. That right belongs to my friends, and no one else.

PS.
No, DON'T tell me it's because I'm Hard Gay that I deserved it, because I didn't harass anyone at the con without permission because I respected THEIR privacy.
I demand my respect in return, and that means no glomping.

Hi quantbits, sorry you have such a bad interaction with the Glompers, there are a few bad apples out there and yes, they need to be educated and my I suggest using a 'clue-by-four' and verbally telling them what they have done wrong.  If that doesn't work, get their name, if you see a Rover/Safety patrol, let them know about it, if you don't see a partol, come to ConOps and make a report.  If nothing else, get the name and badge number.

I agree with you that you have the right to not be physically abuse by someone 'glomping' you, especially if it creeps you out.

Craige...

[LadyKaren]

I still think it would be a good idea to post the code of conduct on the main Fanime page. And if it IS up there already, I apologize. I haven't gone hunting for it recently.

Hi Xeluu, yeah, you're right, it needs to be up on the web site and that's something I've passed along, hopefully in the near future.

Someone want to give me said code of conduct so I can put it on the website?

[quantbits]

I still think it would be a good idea to post the code of conduct on the main Fanime page. And if it IS up there already, I apologize. I haven't gone hunting for it recently.

Hi Xeluu, yeah, you're right, it needs to be up on the web site and that's something I've passed along, hopefully in the near future.

Someone want to give me said code of conduct so I can put it on the website?

Let's see.

I can write a 3 page essay about it... but what format did you want it?

[M]

Someone want to give me said code of conduct so I can put it on the website?

Let's see.

I can write a 3 page essay about it... but what format did you want it?

LadyKaren: It'll be emailed to you from the appropriate people. Let me remind you that the forums isn't the correct place to request said documents and that e-mails is probably the fastest way to get a reply.

Quantbits: Writing an essay doesn't help us out as it's not the official code of conduct and would only be your take on what it should be. ;)

[PassingTheBuck]

Quantbits: Writing an essay doesn't help us out as it's not the official code of conduct and would only be your take on what it should be. ;)

Oh MPLe, my knees go weak when you take such forceful command of the situation...  ;D  <even when I do agree with you.>   :D

[quantbits]

Oh, I wasn't actualy going to write A essay.

I was using a figure of speech.  ;D

Someone want to give me said code of conduct so I can put it on the website?

Let's see.

I can write a 3 page essay about it... but what format did you want it?

LadyKaren: It'll be emailed to you from the appropriate people. Let me remind you that the forums isn't the correct place to request said documents and that e-mails is probably the fastest way to get a reply.

Quantbits: Writing an essay doesn't help us out as it's not the official code of conduct and would only be your take on what it should be. ;)

[darkstar]

Well, if they're going to be as hardcore as they were last year (and as they appeared to be), then glomping needs to be banned, and inappropriate glomping needs to be referred to the police for the assault it is.

[ToshiX]

Glomping Dont Really Need to Be Banned

All I Say is Be Curdious And Ask the Person Before
Glomping

I Was Kind Of Ticked Cause Of my Prop Getting Damage By Glomps

But Its A Persons Nature ^ ^

So Just Ask

[Jun-Watarase]

Though, I'm not sure if this is official yet.

It was said in the last meeting that inappropriate signs that promote anything illegal, like soliciting, are prohibited. This includes "Glomp me", "Free hugs", "Hugs for Pocky", or anything similar, along with advertisements without a permit. They'll probably be dealt with on a case by case basis. Signs with jokes/funny phrases, cosplay relevance, prop, or information (gatherings, etc) should be okay.

[Moonblossom]

Well, if they're going to be as hardcore as they were last year (and as they appeared to be), then glomping needs to be banned, and inappropriate glomping needs to be referred to the police for the assault it is.

I'm one of the loud, adamant anti-glomp people, and even I don't think it needs to be -entirely- banned. If two people are okay being the glomper and the glompee, that's fine with me, and I think everyone else on this side of the argument. It's only when it's done without consent that I think action needs to be taken.

It's kind of like anything to do with physical contact/sexuality. What you want to do with a willing partner is your business, just don't force it on others.

[PyronIkari]

Well, if they're going to be as hardcore as they were last year (and as they appeared to be), then glomping needs to be banned, and inappropriate glomping needs to be referred to the police for the assault it is.

I'm one of the loud, adamant anti-glomp people, and even I don't think it needs to be -entirely- banned. If two people are okay being the glomper and the glompee, that's fine with me, and I think everyone else on this side of the argument. It's only when it's done without consent that I think action needs to be taken.

It's kind of like anything to do with physical contact/sexuality. What you want to do with a willing partner is your business, just don't force it on others.

It was also brought up at the last meeting. It constitutes sexual harassment to hug anyone unwantedly, or to even pursue asking them. Technically... asking them once is sexual harassment. Doing things like this are grounds for getting your badge pulled and getting removed from the con. For the most part, I don't think anyone is going to do anythng if they're cosplaying and you ask them, but if you pursue it and ask them multiple times, OR you ask multiple times, or ask random people... don't be suprised if you get your badge pulled...

that is if that 20 minute speech about sexual harassment and the such from the last meeting was understood correctly by me.

Asking for photographs, or taking people's photographs is okay, as long as you don't ask them anything like "Can you show more skin" or "do a more sexy pose" or something like that.

Basically, the convention is going to try harder to uphold the laws of the city/state. Randomly hugging people on the streets, holding signs of solicitation (even if it means giving away something for free... like hugs or the such) are against the rules, so don't do it, and tell people not to do them. Signs aren't banned, but a good majority of KINDS OF SIGNS are banned. Also, limitations on realistic usages, if signs are too big, to where they can cause a hazard or if signs are in poor taste, they are also banned.