Thank you everyone for coming out to the dance lessons and the Black and White Ball this year. The staff, instructors, and assistants all had a great time this weekend. The Black and White Ball reached capacity within an hour of opening the doors and over 2000 people showed up for the 5 hour event!!! We changed up a few things this year and we were wondering how well they worked and what everyone thought about them. Everything from the lessons, the demonstrations on stage zero, the Black and White Ball itself, etc. As everyone knows, Fanime is put on by fans for fans so we really want to know what you think, good or bad. So let us know what worked and what didn't so we can make 2011 that much better. Thanks!
- Jim
BWBall Head 2010
The main feedback that I got from talking to people who attended:
A) The solo dancing (Thriller, conga line, macarena) while enjoyable for the participants was a danger to people on the floor since the solo dancers were not really looking out where they were going. It wasn't so bad for the spot dances, i.e. swing/salsa, but when the dance was a travelling dance like foxtrot, the chances of accidents went up. One follower mentioned that she accidentally stomped on someone's foot because they rolled in during their line dance and she stepped backwards.
B) I got blizzarded by DJ requests. I will comment here the same way I replied during the ball: if you have requests, we had the forum thread open for at least four months. We don't take requests at the ball because if every 20th person who went to the ball requested a song, we would have a request list that would be longer than the actual playlist at the ball. I might add that I loved the response I got when I mentioned that - "Well, just pick the good ones." My civil reply was to ask how THAT would be decided.
C) We had some information gaps that luckily did not derail anything substantially. Even so, we still had questions on things that were either clearly stated here on the forum or printed out in all the media at FanimeCon. I'm not sure how it can be addressed.
D) The volume of the music at the Ball was a little uneven. Some songs I could hear clearly. Some I could probably hear clearly if it was an empty ballroom with no crowd noise. Some songs I was lucky to hear at all. And some were a little loud.
Okay, enough of the negatives. I got universally positive comments about the demos at Stage Zero and the B&W Ball. The mixers worked. I didn't receive any substantial complaints about the lessons. The ballroom was beautiful and the floor rocked (shoutout to Frank Carricato of American Portable Dance floor, his staff and the people who worked on putting it together and broke it down after fun and games on Sunday). The atmosphere was electric throughout the evening.
Some personal notes: Apologies to the people during the ball that I declined giving lessons to due to fatigue or lack of memory. I tried looking for you guys but you got lost in the throng. Apologies to the students in my classes who got mercilessly flogged by my snarkiness. If it makes you feel better, I'm like that only with people who I'm comfortable around :). Thanks to my fellow staff/instructors/assistants for being a bunch of nice people (Rebecca, Ming Sum, Sam, Josh, Kevin, Mark, David, Craig and Travis come to mind). Thanks to Jim for giving me this opportunity to just be myself. Hope I didn't horrify you :). Finally, thanks to Alaina, my shadow in teaching and dancing this past weekend. If I accomplished anything this past weekend, she had a large part in it.
the swing mixer was fun, altho i did get stepped on by an instructor cuz there was just WAYY too many ppl on the floor
im sad that i wasn't there for the solo dances cuz that could have been fun
but the set up of the ballroom was amazing
maybe next time there could be more mixers like the swing mixer
the waltz mixer was okay but there was a possibility that u didnt get to dance
i wish the music was a little louder because sometimes i couldn't hear it
it was fun wit the demonstrations and stuff
good job :)
i had a blast!
Quote from: Okach on May 31, 2010, 09:04:35 PM
The main feedback that I got from talking to people who attended:
A) The solo dancing (Thriller, conga line, macarena) while enjoyable for the participants was a danger to people on the floor since the solo dancers were not really looking out where they were going. It wasn't so bad for the spot dances, i.e. swing/salsa, but when the dance was a travelling dance like foxtrot, the chances of accidents went up. One follower mentioned that she accidentally stomped on someone's foot because they rolled in during their line dance and she stepped backwards.
B) I got blizzarded by DJ requests. I will comment here the same way I replied during the ball: if you have requests, we had the forum thread open for at least four months. We don't take requests at the ball because if every 20th person who went to the ball requested a song, we would have a request list that would be longer than the actual playlist at the ball. I might add that I loved the response I got when I mentioned that - "Well, just pick the good ones." My civil reply was to ask how THAT would be decided.
C) We had some information gaps that luckily did not derail anything substantially. Even so, we still had questions on things that were either clearly stated here on the forum or printed out in all the media at FanimeCon. I'm not sure how it can be addressed.
D) The volume of the music at the Ball was a little uneven. Some songs I could hear clearly. Some I could probably hear clearly if it was an empty ballroom with no crowd noise. Some songs I was lucky to hear at all. And some were a little loud.
Okay, enough of the negatives. I got universally positive comments about the demos at Stage Zero and the B&W Ball. The mixers worked. I didn't receive any substantial complaints about the lessons. The ballroom was beautiful and the floor rocked (shoutout to Frank Carricato of American Portable Dance floor, his staff and the people who worked on putting it together and broke it down after fun and games on Sunday). The atmosphere was electric throughout the evening.
Some personal notes: Apologies to the people during the ball that I declined giving lessons to due to fatigue or lack of memory. I tried looking for you guys but you got lost in the throng. Apologies to the students in my classes who got mercilessly flogged by my snarkiness. If it makes you feel better, I'm like that only with people who I'm comfortable around :). Thanks to my fellow staff/instructors/assistants for being a bunch of nice people (Rebecca, Ming Sum, Sam, Josh, Kevin, Mark, David, Craig and Travis come to mind). Thanks to Jim for giving me this opportunity to just be myself. Hope I didn't horrify you :). Finally, thanks to Alaina, my shadow in teaching and dancing this past weekend. If I accomplished anything this past weekend, she had a large part in it.
Fellow assistant/instructor Kevin here to make a few comments about this years Ball before I go to bed. This years was better than last years, with a better floor (this one did not fall apart), dance lessons were more organized (thank you David for the syllabus), and with a bigger floor we could get more people out on the dance floor at once. Just to respond to some of Alfred's comments.
1. If we saw this happening we tried to stop it as soon as possible, but with some many bodies out on the floor it was hard to see clearly at times. Maybe a reminder by Jim about no conga lines, etc. would be helpful for next year. Most the people doing this did not want to dance with partners and felt that this was more of rave type dance (don't know if I am using the right word), maybe more of a dnace where you could jump in place or form random conga lines.
2. Not much to comment here except use the forums, or use the Black and White Ball email with your requests and we will consider them, that does not mean we will play the song if we do not feel it is a danceable tune.
3. That is on print, not much we can do about that than other than remind them before the Con starts.
4. I believe the volume issue requires a rethinking of how we listen to next years playlist. Now that we know what the room sounds like with over 900 people in it at once, and the acoustics, we will have to more particular on the sound of the beat. Could we make the volume of the song higher, I know David tempo adjusted some songs could something similar be done for volume with having the up the volume on the sound board constantly.
Now the question becomes how can we top this year, we can't get a bigger ballroom, the Imperial is the biggest in San Jose and the floor will be the same. So please continue with your suggestions and comments, this was a lot better than last year. Also thanks for all the instructors that showed up that were listed to show up that was a great help.
My first Black and White Ball, I absolutely loved it! I arrived a little late in the evening so I didn't get to experience the hole thing.
All the staff were so welcoming and enjoyable. :) I had no trouble getting in. ^^
Although, near the end the water was running low and I was getting a little dehydrated.
The Conga line was fun for myself and my friends who weren't really big on partner dancing but I'm 5'1" and ended up behind a really tall person, making in hard to maneuver.
Definitely a highlight of the con. Can't wait for next year!
I just want to say that the B&W Ball this year was incredible. I know many people appreciated the organized dance lessons. Even for knowledgeable ballroomers, these classes were fun and enjoyable. A small suggestion, it would be nice if intermediate panels were offered (though private lessons did satisfy this) for larger groups.
I would complain that there wasn't enough room during traveling dances, but just thinking about that makes me smile. Rarely do I get the opportunity to dance on a huge dance floor like the Imperial Ballroom's and to see the dance floor completely covered in nerds dressed in crazy outfits having a good time doesn't bother me at all. I'm glad we had the opportunity to use the Imperial Ballroom and I'm also happy that we were able to fill it. I have no complaints about the space provided for the ball.
During the dance, I want to thank you guys for the water. It was nice and refreshing after an intense Salsa. The only suggestion I would have would be to have some sort of labeling device so that dancers could differentiate between their cups. I know a lot of people used anywhere from 3-5 glasses because they either lost their glass in a gathering of cups or someone else grabbed their glass by accident. Maybe if colored plastic cups were offered, or even just a large black sharpie so people can write their names, people would use less cups.
That's all I can say about the ball. I had an extraordinary time during the ball and have decided to come back next year because of the ball, so it better be just as great :P
I want to thank all the instructors for their hard work and support during the panels and the ball. Having the instructors there made the ball more formal and professional, which I greatly appreciate.
Thanks everyone for an awesome Black & White Ball and Fanime 2010!
To respond to the Okach's comments:
A) I don't see how the solo dances were any more dangerous than a bunch of beginners dancing without knowing what to do. They also presented something that everyone was comfortable with and had fun doing.
B) Perhaps a poll/request box can be placed on the official fanime page so that more people contribute to choosing the songs.
C) Yes, having the lesson schedule in the printed schedule would definitely have helped. Also if it was made available as a pdf many people would be able to download it to put on their phones.
D) I didn't really have an issue with the music volumes, but the com system for making announcements definitely needs work. It was too quiet and fuzzy to understand most of the time.
I think that if some of the songs were more traditional, beginners (like myself) would have an easier time dancing to them.
Maybe there could be a designated beginners area where some of the teachers hang out instead of only roaming the dance floor giving lessons here and there.
While the demos were definitely fun to watch, I think having additional demos of just the basic steps for each type of song would help a lot of people.
The mixer was fun and in my opinion worked well. It should definitely be done again next year.
Over all though, great job. I had a blast and can't wait for next year!
-Relsek
Thank you for the feedback!
@princesskitty18 - Oops, sorry! That probably was me - my swingout was a little more out than normal because of the excitement :). More mixers - noted.
@darkbluesign - Water, ooh right. Forgot about the running out. Thanks! As for cup marking - it's useful for up to about 20-30 people, then it gets awful. We packed the ballroom and it's supposed to hold 900. Yowsa. Maybe encourage people to bring their own cups/bottles with labels to save the earth?
@Relsek - Congratulations, you get my undivided attention :).
A) The dangerous comment was not made by me. It was the exact word used by people partner dancing in or around the area of the line dances. As to why it's dangerous on travelling dances, you have movement along both the short side and the long side of the floor crossing paths. And on some of the line dances, you travel a significant amount side to side. (for that matter, I saw the "Hollywood" tango and cringed). Perhaps a "watch where you are" warning at periods in the ball would help.
Officially, the ball is for partner dancing straight up. We offered free classes Friday through Sunday during the day and even had Saturday night classes. You didn't even need a partner. We played different music for the different dances and even displayed what dance was appropriate. We had staff wearing blue armbands that you could ask to dance with at anytime. I think I turned down only two dances the entire evening because I was going to collapse if I didn't take a break.
Unofficially speaking as someone who's gone to a lot of dance conventions, I didn't mind the line dances - but I minded where they took place on the floor. Usually line dances would be in the corner near the DJ booth to allow people moving around a chance to maneuver past. Having them in the middle of the floor is a Bad Idea (TM).
B) Hmm...good idea. How would a viewers' choice half hour sound?
C) It was definitely in the pocket guide - which printed schedule were you talking about.
D) Noted.
We did have some traditional songs, but our intent this year was to get a little more anime/j-pop into the mix. We'll see about incorporating more traditional for next year.
Most of the instructors ended up hanging out near the DJ booth, and people were finding us all night. We did roam a bit because the ballroom was HUGE.
Demos - I'm wondering if we just had the instructors doing steps during the intro if that wouldn't help. And I had basics in my demo....just not necessarily all together :P.
I wanted to start out saying that the B&W Ball along with the lessons was the highlight of my weekend!
Negative:
1. All of the water ran out. Luckily I brought my own bottle, but when I went to refill it there was no water. =(
2. Some people did not have the dress code enforced. There were several ladies wearing super short skirts, which I don't have a problem with if wearing that kind of thing is ok for everyone.
3. I could not hear the announcements at all.
4. People standing around on the dance floor. I didn't even really mind the people dancing in groups or the spontaneous Thriller because they were DANCING, but the standing around really got in the way of travelling.
The AWESOME:
1. The dance lessons. I attended 4 lessons including: Salsa, Argentinian Tango, Waltz, and East Coast Swing. I wanted to take the time to thank the instructors for teaching this very uncoordinated person the basics. I liked it so much my husband and I are going to start taking lessons together.
2. Good mix of music.
3. The dance floor was great and very easy to dance on. I didn't feel like I was going to trip or slide on it.
4. The demonstrations were amazing! I especially loved the West Coast Swing Demo during the Ball. It looked like the dancers had a lot of fun doing it.
5. I got dipped. Ok, I know this isn't usually a huge deal but it made my weekend. I'm a pretty tall girl (5'10) so I don't get a chance to be girly very often, but during one of the tangos I was with a lead about 4 inches shorter than me but experienced. I'm not sure how he managed it, but he dipped me back during the tango and then snapped me back to him in a way that made me feel like a Spanish princess in a cheesy romance novel. I probably could have died happy after that dance, so thanks for your hard work that made the ball possible!
The other staff members have already addressed most of the concerns, but Green_Tea, we did notice the ladies with the very short dresses, and will be figuring out how to improve enforcement for next year.
Mostly, I'd like to post to thank everyone who came out to our classes, especially those who came to more than one! It was such a great feeling to see familiar faces in the crowd, and then again at the ball itself. When someone says, "I plan to take more lessons after this," (or shows up for nearly *EVERY* single one of our lessons!) that's pretty much the best reward for our time we could get. It was a privilege to have the chance to teach all of you something new.
And since I'm in speech mode, I'd like to thank my fellow staffers and volunteers - you guys were such a supportive group. I have to say, the coolest thing about Fanime is: Where else could I have had the opportunity to assist and dance with an all-star level WCS dancer... all weekend long? (Thank you, Alfred!)
Glad to have met all of you - please let us know how we can tighten things up for next year!
While ballroom dancing is fun, I wish there were official times (to avoid chaos) where the attendees can do the Cha Cha Slide, Thriller, etc. without worrying about hurting each other. I think it would create a nice balance between the formality of ballroom dancing and the freedom of solo dancing.
Also, this is just a small wording thing, but my friends and I feel that the demonstrations should be announced as "performances." The word, demonstration makes it sound like the audience should try following their dance steps. It's kind of intimidating. :x
Thank you everyone for your feedback so far. Keep them coming. :) I just wanted to put my two cents in on things too.
First off, thank you to my 2nd who helped with everything behind the scenes, kept me sane for the past few monthes, grounded, and made sure I ate during the weekend. You are the best!!! Also thank you to all the instructors and assistants. Without all their hard work and energy, the Black and White Ball would not have been possible. I was busy running around during the weekend but they really took charge of things and really made the Black and White Ball a great success. Alfred, Alaina, David, Kevin, Travis, Tony, Ming-Sum, Mark, Rebecca, Forest, Scott, Craig, Samantha, and Joshua.
Thank you to all that came out to the Black and White Ball, demonstrations at stage zero, and dance lessons for your support. You are the main reason why we have this event and the reason why it was such as big success. I mean, we reached capacity within an hour of opening the doors and we stayed that way until the end of the night!
Addressing some of the issues that have been brought to my attention:
Solo dances: There was Thriller, the Macarena, and a conga line this year and they are fun dances. My concern was for anyone who was trying to dance a travelling dance like a Waltz or Foxtrot. It gets to be a danger for them because feet can get trampled on and tripped over. There was some stomping in the Thriller dance and that can definitely hurt people if they are stomped on. Having fun is great but the safety of everyone at the BWBall is higher on my priority list. We will see what we can do to accommodate some of this next year. Also the conga lines, my only worry is when it goes through the dance floor. People are trying to dance in the middle and when that line snakes through the middle that is when it becomes a danger. Please remember that there are other people dancing there and if you do not like the dance or know how to do the dance, please do not interrupt the other dancers.
Music: There was a thread on the forums that started a few weeks after the BWBall in 2009. People were able to make requests there and we tried to incorporate those songs into the playlist. The suggestions were great and we are hoping that we get more suggestions for next year. We went through each song that was suggested and listened to each one to see if they would fit in with the theme or the dances that were danced at the BWBall. Staff members when through and cut music and tempo changed music to make it easier for everyone to dance to. I will be starting a request thread for next year so start thinking about different songs to use and post them when the thread comes up. People can email
[email protected] with requests also.
Print & Information: Our printing department at Fanime was awesome and printed 4 posters for us. One of the posters had all the dance lessons listed as well as the time of each one and the location. It was located right outside the hallway that leads down toward the J Ballroom where the dance lessons were held. The schedule was also available online on the FanimeCon website under Black and White Ball. The dances and times were also listed in the pocket guide this year. There was one lesson that was missing in the pocket guide but that was more my fault than anything because I didn't catch it before it was too late. I apologize for that. But there were announcements in the pocket guide, by the place of the lessons, and on the website. The PDF sounds like a good idea and we will see about that for next year.
Volume: I don't have the deepest voice so I apologize for not being able to hear announcements. Also with 900 people in the room, I had the volume at its highest and people still couldn't hear. We will see what we can do about that for next year. The music, some if was submitted by fans, some were from staff, and other places. The quality of the music was good but because we did not have the sound system set up so that we could test 5.5 hours of music, we couldn't really adjust everything. That is something to be looked at next year also.
Some special thanks from me: American Portable Dance Floor - Frank and Laurie thank you so much! The floor was great!, FanimeCon staff and volunteers - You guys really came to the rescue when help was needed. Thank you for staying up late and helping with breakdown and thank you for helping with setup also. Print - Thank you for the wonderful posters as well as the extra manpower for setup! Alen - Thank you for coming out and providing photography for people. It was a great way to have a memento of the evening. Janet - Thank you for providing flowers for the event. The roses were wonderful!
Cheers,
Jim
BWBall Head 2010
BWBall 2nd 2009
BWBall Instructor 2008
For marking water cups, I am just worried where would we get sharpies for that many people and what happens when they run out or people take them home with them. It is not bad to keep the cup with you at your location of your items or friends such as a table or chair. Or maybe even use a different cup each time.
As far as I know we had a rover downstairs at the Fairmont, and a rover at the door making sure the dress code was enforced, maybe that needs to be clarified for next year.
@kleptomaniac - Hmmm...that actually gives me ideas, which I will ruthlessly suppress for at least another couple of days ;).
As for wording, Webster's states:
Main Entry: dem·on·stra·tion
Pronunciation: \ˌde-mən-ˈstrā-shən\
Function: noun
Date: 14th century
1 : an act, process, or means of demonstrating to the intelligence: as a (1) : conclusive evidence : proof (2) : derivation 5 b : a showing of the merits of a product or service to a prospective consumer
2 : an outward expression or display
3 : a show of armed force
4 : a public display of group feelings toward a person or cause
Still a valid description based on 1) and 2), I'd say. :P
The B&W Ball seems to get better every year. :D Keep it up!
There were quite a few things that I liked about this year:
- The increased number of tables to sit at made it much easier to hang out with friends, take a break, or stash belongings
- The floor stayed in one piece! No more danger while wearing thin heels!
- The cups were being restocked, which was good, since I remember running out much earlier last year (and running out of water earlier last year, too)
- The table decorations were wonderful, with the little fake candles and the confetti and everything.
- All the extras, like pictures and flowers being sold, were nice touches.
There were also some improvements that could be made:
- The music. I would have prefered less popular music and more traditional music or oldies, like last year. All the popular music made it feel like a regular dance (or even like high school prom) and less like a formal ball. I think that it needed a better balance between the two.
- I really liked how last year, the firs hour or two was slower and more traditional, but then it picked up later in the night and had faster music with a few "breaks" with slower dances sprinkled throughout. This year, it seemed all over the place in regards to the types and speeds of dances, and I felt like as soon as I got dancing to something higher energy, it switched to something slower and I lost that momentum, sat back down, and then didn't feel like getting up again until another faster song. I would like it better if the songs were grouped better instead of a seemingly random energy pattern.
- The dress code enforcement was spotty at best. Girls in miniskirts, I think I saw someone in jeans, etc.
- Correct me if I'm wrong here since I got there about an hour after the doors opened, but no Tank! this year? You always play Tank!, and I was looking forward to it. (There was also a lack of Waltz for Zizi, which I'm not too upset about, but I certainly missed Tank!)
Tank! while fun and jazzy, doesn't really cut it as a swing song for me.
I was expecting it because it seems to be played every year (almost like a tradition?), but if you don't want to play it, then that's fine~ I know that I missed it, though.
Eh, just my opinion on the song. It didn't end up on the final playlist, but I didn't input on that particular song. As for the rest, the playlist may not have been perfect, but it kept the floor busy. I'm the first to admit that adding WCS to the dance list would skew the music a bit more towards contemporary since that's what's being played at WCS conventions. Thanks for the input!
I loved the ball :) The larger floor was definitely an improvement, and I really enjoyed the dancing demonstrations. Oh, and posting what kind of dance you could do for each song was VERY helpful. However...
1) While I appreciated that there was water on-site, I wish it had been in more...secure containers, like five-gallon water coolers or something. I'm kind of a paranoid person, and with the removable tops on the water containers, I was afraid to drink the water for fear it might have been tampered with. (I know the tops were removable, because I saw one attendee remove a lid, jokingly wear it as a hat for a few minutes, then put it back on the container.)
2) I think it might be helpful if "line of dance" were included in the dance lessons. Though it doesn't matter for the stationary dances, like salsa, it'd be really helpful for the traveling dances if everyone was traveling in the same counterclockwise direction.
Ball was amazing! Oneof the highlights of the weekend :) The environment was great, as always, and I met a lot of new people! And even though I was a girl, I had no trouble asking guys to dance :)
The good:
The ballroom was absolutely beautiful this year!
The florists were such a cute idea :)
I liked how there was a variety of japanese, traditional, and popular music. It kept things fun :)
I think the solo dances definietely help some of the shyer people loosen up.
The instructors were great- I asked one to dance, and even though I wasn't that good he was understanding, nice, and even gave me a few pointers
Demos= AMAZING
Possible improvements:
My friends and I wanted a professional picture taken, but they were expensive! D: I get that it costs money, but 10$ per person?
A coat check or something would be great :)
Some food being sold would be cool
I left to go to the bathroom, and when we came back there was a line. We had left our badges inside so our friend had to run and get them. Not fun :( Maybe having a small area for people to take a breather or answer phone calls (but not leave so they dont have to rewait in line!) would be nice.
How often was water refilled? People were constantly struggling to get the last drops.
A few years ago, the instructors encouraged everyone, including people with dates/boyfriends to dance with other people. This isn't always about romance, it's about meeting new friends! I think that was a nice thing to add to the instructors speech during the lessons
Other things:
I saw some complaints about the short dress thing, but this rule was not enforced in the years before, and my friends had brought only short dresses so I appreciated them not being thrown out. Maybe you could post all the dress code rules online?
I always love going to the Fanime ballroom dance. It is certainly my favorite of out all the cons I have been to. Fanime does it right and I hope it keeps the tradition going. The best way I can describe Fanime is that it's the otaku prom without the high school shenanigans.
A Few of My Favorite Things
+ Dress code was enforced. Yay!
+ I felt my stuff was safe to leave on the chairs. It seems that everyone was looking after each other's stuff. Very safe.
+ Loved the demonstrations.
+ I like the mix of J-pop, Animusic, and popular (American) music. Keep that balance going. I was happy to hear Jay Sean and Jason DeRulo.
+ I like the happy medium between a ballroom dance and a prom type of setting.
+ Keep those dance lessons up!
+ Decorations and added tables and new dance floor = good ideas.
+ Thanks for listening to our suggestions from last year, Fanime!
Suggestions
+ I think there needs to be much more clarity on that an attendee does not necessarily need to wear black or white for the dance. I had friends tell me, "I'd like to go, but I don't have anything in black or white."
Being my first time at Fanime, I felt that the Ball was the highlight of my experience.
The Awesome:
The music was great and loved the selection.
Found it a HUGE help that there were people willing to teach me some dances.
Cool idea of selling roses outside. It helped my friend get a girl's info and now some chemistry is starting. ;D
The lighting was actually not bad even though my friends thought it could have been darker.
The Not So Good:
Some of us thought there was food.
The dance floor was a tad small.
Not enough mixers.
I seriously can't wait for next years ball. Makes me wish that this was bi-yearly.
Quote from: pokkypok on June 01, 2010, 08:12:04 PM
Other things:
I saw some complaints about the short dress thing, but this rule was not enforced in the years before, and my friends had brought only short dresses so I appreciated them not being thrown out. Maybe you could post all the dress code rules online?
The dress code rules are posted online and in the programming guide. Also, there was a thread on the forums to ask if your outfit was appropriate or not.
There did seem to be a lot of confusion over the black and white thing, though. I'm not sure how to fix that except for renaming the ball, because it was clear to me (who regularly browses the forums, familiarized myself with the dress code, etc.), but it apparently wasn't to most people.
I had so much fun during my 1st time @ the B&WB..
the ambiance & scene were both elegant, and gave off an essence of pure Aristocracy.
Oh how I wish I could've stayed longer, & I wish my feet weren't so weak..! D:
But I did have a wonderful time, & I await next year's B&WB.
I liked the dancing-matching pairs, that was awesome, & the dance lessons really helped.. though I hate to admit that I've forgotten the Tango, & the Nite-Club 2 Step.
I apologize! >_<
I only wish that I knew the names of my wonderful table mates.. including that Gil (Pandora Hearts) cosplayer that was such a gentleman.. P: {He was so tall.. I felt so short.. *_*)
I also appreciated the fact that the dress code was enforced.. it gave me chance to see how strict dress codes could be.
You guys did an amazing job on everything, & I think it was all well planned out. (even the water "container/dispenser" looked pretty fancy ^^)
Oh Yes, & there were some downsides, as some people have already noticed:
-Many people thought food would be served
-More dance mixes?
Quick hits:
A) There was supposed to be a coat check, but it fell through at the last minute. Sorry about that - hopefully no one's stuff grew legs. We found a bra strap, a lens cap, a hair clip and a pair of white opera gloves during the post dance cleanup.
B) There were snacks provided in at least 2007, but several things have changed. First, using the Fairmont. Second, a really heinous corkage fee. Third, the ludicrous prices the hotel would be charging for food. End result: No food for this year's B&W Ball.
C) Origins of the Black & White Ball: http://www.animecons.com/news/article.shtml/499. The original intent was to encourage dressing up, though from the pictures at the time it looked rather more like a slightly more dressed up version of the FanimeCon dance.
Quote from: cesspooloflight on June 01, 2010, 10:00:47 PM
The dance floor was a tad small.
I don't know if we can get a bigger dance floor, and if we do that means less tables and chairs for people to sit on. ;D
I was glad a lot of people were out their dancing, we wouldn't have been able to fit even a third of the people that were on this year's dance floor than the floor we had for 2009.
It's possible to get a bigger dance floor, but really it's a budget decision. I can tell you that the floor is pretty much close in size to what you would see at a ballroom/WCS convention, so it's not like it was prohibitively small :).
I also want to thank the staff members for improving on the ball event so much this year. It was really fun and awesome, definitely better than last year's event. :] I don't think there's too much I have to say without echoing some of the common comments others have posted already...but I do agree enough on the unnecessary crowding on the dance floors to mention in my post as well. There really were too many people who weren't even dancing crowding up the floor. Must be my biggest annoyance in general on the dance floor. One of the few disappointments for me personally was that we couldn't really waltz at all because it was just too darn crowded. Out of maybe five attempts, we managed to make only one round on the floor without too much bumper car-ing around. Also looking around, I think a lot of couples were kind of..."shuffle" dancing...the usual prom-waddle-back-and-forth-in-place slow dance? I absolutely have nothing against that but I think it could help to mention along with the line of dance etiquette that dancers who are more or less stationary or traveling less could stay closer towards the center of the floor so people traveling more have the more expansive area towards the floor's edge to move. I think that's usually how it goes at typical dance parties, but it's kind of left unsaid in those crowds even I forget a lot of people may not know that. I do have my doubts on how effective mentioning that might be though, considering the sheer size of the crowd, but just a suggestion.
Also, as far as the music went, I guess I don't have much to say about the selection. To be honest I'm happy dancing to anything, and I was really there for the dance event more than anything, hehe. The volume was all over the place sometimes though. Maybe if you guys have time for next year's event, you could even out the volumes of each song file with a program so it'll be less problematic once it plays? I do it sometimes for my iPod ;]
Oh, and although it wasn't really a big deal or anything, I did notice that some of the songs were labeled incorrectly on the playlist on the projector. I heard so many cha cha tracks passed as rumba or swing (I'm aware some songs can be interpreted as different dances, but I think sometimes the different tempo made it harder to adjust to, especially for beginners, I noticed). I also recall some foxtrot/rumba mixups too, even quickstep songs passed as swing...just to name a few. I don't suppose it's that much of an issue if people could still pick up the rhythm or if they knew they could dance something else to the song playing, but at times my partner and I would end up walking on and off the floor a bunch of times when we realized what type of song was really playing. Became a bit of a hassle, especially when trying to beat the crowds to get a good spot on the floor, lol.
And just one more thing...more of a question/suggestion, really. I'm just wondering if next year's selection might be able to include at least one song for some of the other common ballroom dances that weren't included in the lesson lineup, like Viennese waltz, quickstep, or samba. I know most of the attendees probably wouldn't know those dances, but some of my friends and I were a little bummed that some of those weren't included. I know they were in there last year (I did catch a few sambas and quicksteps in this year's selection too), probably more often than they should have been played, but I dunno... Would've been fun to be able to dance those at least once. If it's a possibility at all for next year, I think just a small mention somewhere that these dances would be included in the selection in advance wouldn't hurt, to ease on any possible confusion. Maybe people might even be encouraged over the year to take some lessons and learn new dances. Actually, I imagine something like quickstep might be fun for beginners to learn next year. The basic steps shouldn't be any harder than a waltz, maybe it can get thrown in the mix if there's an instructor willing to teach? :] Sorry for being a little long-winded on this note...it's just something I talked to my friend a lot on our way home. A bunch of dance nerds...heehee.
Oh, and I almost forgot one thing I noticed. I saw some people having costume trouble, mostly those with longer trailing garments like coats or gowns. I'm not sure if there were any warnings concerning that, but if there weren't I think it might be very helpful. I did see one unfortunate guy get his long coat get torn when the tail was stepped on by accident.
I think that's the bulk of my thoughts... I did absolutely love our room this year though. Spacious and the floor was excellent. I hated the issues we had with last year's flooring...and the hazards...dear God, but it was great to have like a dancesport-quality floor to dance on this time around. I do wish there was an easy solution to address the crowd size though, but I can't imagine any realistic fixes to that... If anything, I just hope there's something anyone can think of to try and establish dance floor etiquette a little better. I think that's the biggest issue, albeit a difficult one to address since a lot of guests are probably new to ballroom. But hey, let's shoot for an even better event next year. Ah, God...I said I didn't have that much to say and ended up writing an essay, lol...
I actually really liked the B&W ball this year and it was a great improvement from last year. Also, it's great to hear that the b&w ball and the dance lessons sparked an interest in ballroom dancing for some people. I know a few places in the bay area so if you're interested, you can pm me.
Goods:
-The dance floor was great and is actually the type of floor I see at competitions. Thanks Jeannie and all of the other volunteers for putting the floor together and taking it apart afterward.
-The tables, water, decorations, and the huge display screen was great.
-I liked that the dances and upcoming dances were displayed.
-No major accidents, no giant mass of people jumping up and down, and great performances.
Needs improvement:
-The music was hard to hear at times which makes it hard to dance to.
-Some of the songs did not match the dance at all. I know that you can dance a few different dances to the same song but some were still completely off.
-Line of dance should be more clearly emphasized so that people who want to travel can do so. The slower traffic can be closer to the center if that is possible to manage with number of attendees.
Overall, it was pretty fun and I got to do a two-way WCS with Alfred and his friend. That totally threw me by surprise but that was really awesome! Thanks, Alfred. :D I'm definitely look forward to the B&W ball next year. Maybe if I can get my dance partner to come next year, we can do ballroom demo? (Not to show-off or anything but we always wanted to do a showcase at fanime but never got around to it)
I should of posted little sooner but here I go! B&W Ball is amazing this year and I love it and one of the reason I love Fanime and was the highlight for me of the con! This is what I got to say!
And for the attendees who showed up to the dance lessons and B&W Ball and for all the people I danced with:
You guys made my night for the Ball! I have never been asked and thanked by so many people at the ball for learning how to dance even helping couples to show them the basic or alternate ways of enjoying the ball. Glad to see people showing up for the lessons to get better as well. To me, learning to dance will help you build confidence and have alots of fun which was worth taking one so keep it strong. It was also great dancing with partners that look stunning in their outfit! THANKS FOR SHOWING UP AND YOU GUYS ARE AWESOME!
B&W Ball department:
Jim, Alfred, Daniel, Travis, etc... You guys rock and I'm glad and proud to be part of B&W Ball team and I would support them and help other attendees have a great time! I was very surprised when it turns out that I was gonna introduced as the dance assistance to the whole B&W Ball attendees about us even though I'm only a volunteer and I felt pretty welcomed and it was a good thing I decided to change to my Brain Age cosplay so people should remember me. I will keep on supporting the B&W Ball in many years to come.
My personal suggestion: I agree wit White Rose Assasin. I've been hearing from couple of people including cosplayers in formalish attire and people who post on cosplay.com forum that they're don't have B&W and I had to point out many times that you can wear any color as long it meets the dress code.
Speaking of Dress code. I was doing dress code for the before we opened and so far I only saw few didn't pass the dress code regarding shoes which was better than last year since I caught at least around 5 people failed to meet the dress code. Since the line was gone the Rover told me that they're fine and enjoy the ball. Later on towards the last couple hours. Thats when I caught very few not wearing nor following the dress code.
My personal complaint:
I was kind of bummed too that V Waltz wasn't been taught nor any music was played because thats one of my favorite style of Waltz and I would love to help except I'm not the right guy to instruct for that area but a good dance assistance. I know that I heard that its pretty too difficult and too fast to dance to. But Dickens Fair and PEERS event manage to pull it pretty strong and rarely have injuries from when I went last year and plus the dance floor is waaaaay much smaller than B&W Ball room this year and been doing it for years depending on how its ran! Since we have dance assistance we can help control the flow if done right and we should of given it a try. I would of liked it back and I can probably try to recruit one straight from the PEERS group or Fezziwig Warehouse people. I've known few who was very interested in teaching that at Fanime and I can go ask them if I run into them again at the event.
Food not being sold during the B&W Ball? Wow I didn't know that! I wouldn't mind waiting towards the end since they charged everything a dollar. Umm well its a good thing I had something to drink before I showed up. But I think you might as well get the vendors back because not eating at all can be hazardous aside from drinking alots and alots of water. I would kind of suggest do a banquet wit small munchies and snack or punch as if feels like an elegant grand ball feast. Like PEERS event does. But I guess it might depends on budget or doing all the trouble of making the food for us to feed a pack of 900 people which thats gonna be tricky.
My personal thanx:
I like to point out that B&W Ball helped shape the way I am today. Ever since I first attended B&W Ball, I came to get that formal and prom feel since its been 4 years that I last attended before attending one. My first time attending felt very disappointed and felt ashamed that I have no knowledge of ballroom dancing and I felt pathetic. Thinking about my experience on my first B&W Ball, That's the main reason why I started to take more dance classes! As years gone by I started to help out B&W Ball part time then half the time helping out B&W Ball along wit E-gaming. And this year, I commited to put my hours in helping out B&W Ball and will keep helping them out. Now I tooken up to Intermediate Ballroom Class and I'm in the process of learning many type of swing dance and learn more Waltz at city college. So I can use that to not just have more fun and learn new tricks, build more confident in others and give others a great time! Looking back of how I danced at the B&W Ball I can not imagine how much I improved since 2007 and how much it changed me! I never felt so happy to hear from other people that I barely met enjoy B&W Ball and couples that thanked me alot for teaching them helping them. Thank you so much for making Fanime 2010 night to be memorable for me and hopefully I can top it!
): My date ditched me last minute before the Ball, deciding she didn't want to go after all even tho it was totally fine two months ago when I asked x.x It made me sad and end up not even just checking it out by myself...hopefully next year ~.~
Quote from: ket on June 02, 2010, 05:27:54 AM
): My date ditched me last minute before the Ball, deciding she didn't want to go after all even tho it was totally fine two months ago when I asked x.x It made me sad and end up not even just checking it out by myself...hopefully next year ~.~
Aw.. I'm sorry D:
Yes, be hopeful for next year, because there will be plenty of other people you can ask out for dates, or even dancing partners.
There is hope ^^
I feel like the only one who wasn't expecting food to be served. Maybe it's because there hasn't been food since the first year (which... wasn't that great of a year XD), but I would have been surprised if food had been served. Now I'm curious where people were getting that impression.
Quote from: ket on June 02, 2010, 05:27:54 AM
): My date ditched me last minute before the Ball, deciding she didn't want to go after all even tho it was totally fine two months ago when I asked x.x It made me sad and end up not even just checking it out by myself...hopefully next year ~.~
Aww.. You should have come anyways! I went by myself and was never lacking for a partner. There were so many girls waiting around to dance you wouldn't have had to worry about it!
Hope to see you there next year.
There's couple thing I like to let everyone know about B&W Ball.
I know it feels ackward to go by yourself at the B&W Ball but we convinced everyone please show up no matter if you didn't have one or your partner left! That's the whole purpose of our arm band and we even been introduced at the beginning of the ball if you need any help or the need of a dance partner. This is a social dance, not high school prom where you have to show off your date or anything. I don't even have an official date because I know I'm gonna be very busy dancing with alots of people. Trust me you'll won't regret for showing up. I love this event more than my time when I attended my prom.
Whew! It's David, your friendly fanime dance teacher. I'm still getting my voice back, but what a rush this year's dance was! My overwhelming opinion of the dance lessons and B/W ball this year: it surpassed all previous years by miles!
I'ma try to keep this short:
Dance floor: FAB! Of course we all want bigger floors (we're never satisfied), but this year's floor was smooth, springy, had no heel-catching rails between sections, and STAYED TOGETHER! Thx to Alfred & Alaina for suggesting it! Don't know where we'd put a bigger one or how we'd afford it, but I felt the size this year was supremely adequate! ;D
Room on the floor: Yes, the conga/macarena/limboers are disruptive; thankfully they happen more during Salsas/Hustles than Foxtrots/Waltzes due to the type of music. Perhaps we can play Thriller and designate half the floor for Cha Cha/Hustle and the other half for the Thriller dance. Don't know if that'd be inviting trouble. I'm really ok with not playing the macarena. Maybe one or two songs during the night could be reserved for non-ballroom dances to satisfy that section of the crowd. I'm kinda torn; the Black & White Ball is supposed to be our one safe haven for partner dancing at the con (one year I tried to see if anyone would do a Hustle with me at the FanimeCon Dance--hah!) but I don't want to be a stuffy dance spoilsport either. Although....if the people who don't want to partner-dance go elsewhere, it makes more room for those of us trying to partner-dance! Must...stave off....dance snobbery! ::)
But seriously, for most of the evening, it was FAR more possible to move around the dance floor during traveling dances than in past years. Yes, there were people standing in the way chatting idly, or swaying, or doing interpretive dance, but by and large, I couldn't believe how much more people were traveling the dances this year. Everyone who came to the lessons (or already apparently knew how to dance) deserves major kudos for attempting to travel. Not everyone moved counterclockwise 100% of the time, but it's okay to move other directions briefly if you watch where you're going. Maybe let's try to see if announcements can help that.
Announcements: This dang dance needs a manual! There are too many things need announcing, lol. Even if people could hear the announcements, (That's a problem I don't know how to solve. How do you instantly cut through the chatter of 900 people? ...besides mic feedback, that is? Thankfully, none of that this year. Kudos to the sound-check guys.) I worry they'll tune us out after six announcements or so anyway. I think people were better about dance etiquette thanks to all the lesson announcements. Other things worth emphasizing more?
-Line of Dance: (I tried to teach this at all my lessons where the dance traveled). Maybe a quick ann. at the ball? Anyone think it might help? I think one thing we should mention is if you're going to dance a stationary dance like swing during a foxtrot, please dance it in the center of the floor when possible so foxtrotters can go around!
-Funky dances in the middle of the floor so everyone else can go around? At least try to be aware of your surrounding dancers! Someone told me that a dancer got kicked in the head during a swing but that they were ok. PLEASE be careful and responsible dancers, especially if attempting lifts, tricks, or dips.
-Dress Code: We announced this at every single lesson, and had the thread, and had posters with the dress code posted, plus, people could (and did) come ask us whether what they had would be appropriate. I guess for next year let's try again to have a clear, pithy numbered list laying out the guidelines (including that black/white are not the only possible colors) and plaster it everywhere we can that's connected to the ball 'cause clearly, not everyone comes to the lessons.
-Music requests: We asked everyone who asked for a song at the ball to request ahead of time on the forums for next year; hopefully this will help raise awareness. We don't have every song you might request--we may need to track it down and there's no time at the dance. Quick hint from a 5+ year ballroom dance party DJ: just 'cause it says "Waltz" "Salsa", etc. in the title doesn't mean it's always that dance. If you think it's danceable, don't let that stop you from making requests, but don't get too attached to your requests either. If we left it out, there was a reason or there just wasn't enough room.
Music: Overall I liked the music, but I'm biased; I helped with the playlist. But from a danceability perspective alone, I can tell you the music was better. There will always be matters of personal preference; there were a couple of songs I would have replaced. But other people loved them. I personally danced to every song on the playlist in my living room to be sure it was danceable. I recommended we eliminate a number of songs because they did not have a danceable beat--and we did (Sorry, Tank!... I'd be ok playing it, as long as we're upfront that you really CANNOT dance anything but freestyle to this, and I DARE anyone to show me otherwise). I also helped speed up or slow down songs that initially were not ideal speed for dancing.
As far as partner dancing went, I had a hard time dancing to more than 50% of the songs last year. This year, I noticed only two songs that I definitively would have relabeled on the slides. The final Michael Buble song was clearly a Rumba rather than Foxtrot (it was correct on my playlist, but got onto the slides wrong (sorry I didn't catch that, Jim), and there was a Tango "Dance With Me" I really would have labeled Cha Cha (that one might be my bad too), but all the others looked correct to me. A lot of it is personal preference. There's a lot of crossover between Rumba and Cha Cha ("Mercy" by Duffy is a prime example). I love it for Rumba, other people hear the cha-cha-cha in there and simply must dance Cha to it. I saw a number of people dancing Swing during a clear Foxtrot--which is totally fine! I can take another look at the slides to see if there were any other mislabelings I missed, but often times I could hear Cha Cha/Rumba/Hustle/WC Swing all in one dance, and there just wasn't room on the slide to put all that. Advanced dancers used to listening to music are free to ignore the slides and dance what they hear/feel, of course! (Just go in the middle if you wish to dance swing during a foxtrot).
Most of our focus this year was picking fun music that was danceable; next year we'll work more on audibility; I can look at volume and level adjustments to see if we can help. It's just so hard to know how it'll sound in the actual space, with the murmur of nine hundred people. One idea: perhaps if we have enough staff, I could try to play the songs over the giant speakers in the ballroom once they're set up, and we could try to have backups for any songs that sound dubious so we can switch them out on the playlist if needed? It's last-minute work, but I don't know what else to do. Even that doesn't solve the will-it-be-audible-over-the-roar-of-the-crowd? question. If anyone remembers which songs were impossible to hear this year, maybe it can help us. I think it was during "Sakura Kiss" that I couldn't hear the swing beat. Listening at home I can, but in the room the reverb and the crowd backfilled in all the space between the beats until it sounded kinda like a droning rumble. I think I had a similar problem with "Heart Goes Boom!" but now I don't remember...I shoulda taken notes. I couldn't hear "Tango in Harlem" at first but it got better as the song went on. I think the same for Super Mario RPG Bukkis (Tango).
Mixers: I was surprised at how well they went! Staff buddies: let's try to come up with some more for next year, and try to rehearse how to organize them. The self-perpetuating ones like the swing snowball mixer will be easiest to run because they're more or less self-organizing. Maybe we can have little triangles of blue tape on the floor for where to stand to start off for the waltz mixer, that way people will be spaced perfectly and we'll automatically get the right number of leaders and followers matched up without so much herding.
Dances Taught: We can evaluate which dances were in demand this year and consider new dances for next year; I could potentially teach a samba or quickstep (yikes!) lesson, although I might demand real dance shoes as a prerequisite for those classes. Clunky shoes + quickstep = no no.
Anyway, I teach in the area, so if anyone's looking for some lessons between now and next year, PM me and I can get back to ya!
Great job, all! Especially my fellow teachers! You guys made it happen!
@Dave - LOL, I think West Coast Swing ended up with the lowest attendance average out of all of the dances. I should probably not come back next year :).
Quote from: Okach on June 02, 2010, 07:30:12 PM
@Dave - LOL, I think West Coast Swing ended up with the lowest attendance average out of all of the dances. I should probably not come back next year :).
Oh no! I want you to show up next year! I would of like to check out WCS cuz I thought it looks awesome! I just didn't check the time when to check it out.
Quote from: Okach on June 02, 2010, 07:30:12 PM
@Dave - LOL, I think West Coast Swing ended up with the lowest attendance average out of all of the dances. I should probably not come back next year :).
LOL, Alfred, did you forget? Your Saturday evening class was not only quite late at night, it wasn't even advertised! And you
still got some turnout! Your Sunday day class was much much bigger. I know, I saw it ;D
I don't know how my advice will be received since I have personally never attended this event, but here it is anyway.
My friend and her boyfriend had been extremely excited about this dance. They don't personally read the forums here, but they followed the basic guidelines in reference to what is acceptable to wear that were posted on the main website. After attending the dance lessons and being really invested in attending, they were turned away at the door because of her boyfriend's shoes. I'm still not exactly sure why, because they did follow the rules. They were not shiny black dance shoes or anything, but they were black leather shoes - not sneakers. My friend was devastated, and in tears over it, but none of us had any other shoes for him to wear, since we're all from out of town and packed lightly.
So what I hope can be improved on is better communication on the main website and maybe in the pocket guide on what exactly is appropriate to wear. I'm aware that there was a thread where people could ask about clothing choices, but I think it's safe to say that many people did not know that, so perhaps mentioning it on the website would be a good idea. And even having read the rules myself before hand, I was unaware that they would turn him away for those shoes. It's kind of more disheartening to hear that some girls were allowed to break dress code, too. Hopefully there will be a resolution to this for next year that leaves everyone happy.
Quote from: MeowDesu on June 03, 2010, 01:13:58 PM
I don't know how my advice will be received since I have personally never attended this event, but here it is anyway.
My friend and her boyfriend had been extremely excited about this dance. They don't personally read the forums here, but they followed the basic guidelines in reference to what is acceptable to wear that were posted on the main website. After attending the dance lessons and being really invested in attending, they were turned away at the door because of her boyfriend's shoes. I'm still not exactly sure why, because they did follow the rules. They were not shiny black dance shoes or anything, but they were black leather shoes - not sneakers. My friend was devastated, and in tears over it, but none of us had any other shoes for him to wear, since we're all from out of town and packed lightly.
So what I hope can be improved on is better communication on the main website and maybe in the pocket guide on what exactly is appropriate to wear. I'm aware that there was a thread where people could ask about clothing choices, but I think it's safe to say that many people did not know that, so perhaps mentioning it on the website would be a good idea. And even having read the rules myself before hand, I was unaware that they would turn him away for those shoes. It's kind of more disheartening to hear that some girls were allowed to break dress code, too. Hopefully there will be a resolution to this for next year that leaves everyone happy.
I am sorry that your friends and you were not able to attend the BWBall. The dress code will be addressed for next year and your concerns have been noted. The dress code for the BWBall was posted on the FanimeCon website under BWBall and there was a poster of the dresscode outside the J Ballroom where lessons were held. I will see what we can do next year to increase the visibility of the dress code.
- Jim
BWBall Head 2010
@MeowDesu - Out of curiosity, is it possible to see the type of shoes your friend was wearing? Picture on a website somewhere is fine.
Quote from: Okach on June 03, 2010, 02:20:32 PM
@MeowDesu - Out of curiosity, is it possible to see the type of shoes your friend was wearing? Picture on a website somewhere is fine.
Yes, I'll PM you a link to a photo. I'd post it here, but I don't know if that would be embarrassing to them or not.
Fair enough.
Quote from: tkdteo on June 03, 2010, 01:54:47 PM
Quote from: MeowDesu on June 03, 2010, 01:13:58 PM
I don't know how my advice will be received since I have personally never attended this event, but here it is anyway.
My friend and her boyfriend had been extremely excited about this dance. They don't personally read the forums here, but they followed the basic guidelines in reference to what is acceptable to wear that were posted on the main website. After attending the dance lessons and being really invested in attending, they were turned away at the door because of her boyfriend's shoes. I'm still not exactly sure why, because they did follow the rules. They were not shiny black dance shoes or anything, but they were black leather shoes - not sneakers. My friend was devastated, and in tears over it, but none of us had any other shoes for him to wear, since we're all from out of town and packed lightly.
So what I hope can be improved on is better communication on the main website and maybe in the pocket guide on what exactly is appropriate to wear. I'm aware that there was a thread where people could ask about clothing choices, but I think it's safe to say that many people did not know that, so perhaps mentioning it on the website would be a good idea. And even having read the rules myself before hand, I was unaware that they would turn him away for those shoes. It's kind of more disheartening to hear that some girls were allowed to break dress code, too. Hopefully there will be a resolution to this for next year that leaves everyone happy.
I am sorry that your friends and you were not able to attend the BWBall. The dress code will be addressed for next year and your concerns have been noted. The dress code for the BWBall was posted on the FanimeCon website under BWBall and there was a poster of the dresscode outside the J Ballroom where lessons were held. I will see what we can do next year to increase the visibility of the dress code.
- Jim
BWBall Head 2010
Yes, they actually read the one that was posted on the website under BWBall, and his shoes seemed to be okay based on what was written. I think it would have helped to link to the thread (where he could ask about his outfit) directly on that page on the website. Like a section that says "If you have any questions about whether your outfit is acceptable, please address them to this thread in the forums here:" Because many people don't know that that thread exists. The poster outside the lessons room would probably only be beneficial to people who live in San Jose. Those who are from out of town already have their things packed and have to be prepared beforehand. I'm glad that my suggestions are being heard. I know how difficult it must be to run a huge event like this...many things can easily slip through the cracks. :)
Yes, they actually read the one that was posted on the website under BWBall, and his shoes seemed to be okay based on what was written. I think it would have helped to link to the thread (where he could ask about his outfit) directly on that page on the website. Like a section that says "If you have any questions about whether your outfit is acceptable, please address them to this thread in the forums here:" Because many people don't know that that thread exists. The poster outside the lessons room would probably only be beneficial to people who live in San Jose. Those who are from out of town already have their things packed and have to be prepared beforehand. I'm glad that my suggestions are being heard. I know how difficult it must be to run a huge event like this...many things can easily slip through the cracks. :)
[/quote]
Good suggestions. If you could email me the pic also at
[email protected], just so I can take a look too that would be great. Thanks. :)
For anyone else who is curious about the shoes, I found out that they were Clarks brand. While it's not the exact same shoe, since his is a couple years old, it's similar to this style: http://clarks.zappos.com/n/multi_view.cgi?product_id=7414588&color_id=72&view=multi (http://clarks.zappos.com/n/multi_view.cgi?product_id=7414588&color_id=72&view=multi). It is listed on the site as a "casual" shoe, but people commented that they use them for weddings and other occasions . So I don't know, they might be considered to some as too casual for this dance, perhaps?
I personally do not see a problem for these shoes, though others might disagree with me.
Well, the styling is closer to a sneaker than a conventional dress shoe like an oxford, but I would have waved them through considering that the rest of his outfit was compliant.
Yeah, now I think the shoe is kind of borderline casual/dress. Darn ambiguous shoes.
I just wanted to thank you all for the positive responses to my suggestion. My friend will be happy to hear about it, and she'll probably try again next year. Maybe even I'll be there for the first time in my 7 years of con attendance. (I apologize in advance for all the feet that will be stepped on :P)
Come by and take a lesson or two. And hardly any feet will be stepped on.
Trust me, I can't feel my feet by the end of the ball anyways :).
Quote from: Okach on June 04, 2010, 08:45:23 AM
Trust me, I can't feel my feet by the end of the ball anyways :).
Ha! I still can't feel mine. They are still recovering from the dancing. :P
- Jim
Quote from: MeowDesu on June 04, 2010, 01:28:17 AM
Yeah, now I think the shoe is kind of borderline casual/dress. Darn ambiguous shoes.
I just wanted to thank you all for the positive responses to my suggestion. My friend will be happy to hear about it, and she'll probably try again next year. Maybe even I'll be there for the first time in my 7 years of con attendance. (I apologize in advance for all the feet that will be stepped on :P)
We'd love to have you! :) It's a lot of fun, and we'll do our best to make sure no one gets stepped on.
Quote from: Okach on June 04, 2010, 08:45:23 AM
Trust me, I can't feel my feet by the end of the ball anyways :).
I only stopped hobbling around yesterday. >_>;
I want to share my thoughts:
Positives
*Bigger and studier dance floor
*Bigger room
*Great idea having flowers for the dates and couples
*Decorations
Negatives
*Music. I felt last year's music was better and matched the dance.
*Lack of water. I agree the five gallon water dispenser is a good idea. The dispensers don't look pretty in a B&W setting; however, I rather stay hydrated and focused.
General question. Why were the lights on? I remember last year the lights were dimmed to create an intimidate mood.
Personal note, I'm going to improve my dance skills big time for next year's B&W event ^__^
Thanks for the input! I tried to ask as many people as possible immediately after the ball about the music list. We had a roughly 80/15/5 split on like it/like it but could be more traditional/meh. And there were the five or so more people who made DJ requests. Come to think of it, that's about average for all the WCS comps that I've been too. :) When you have 900+ people roaming around the ballroom, it's a forlorn hope to expect everyone to like the music all the time - but the floor was consistently full, so from our perspective as staff it worked.
As for the water situation, we're largely at the mercy of the hotel as to what can be provided to dispense it. And if it's like the other dance events in hotels, FanimeCon got charged unreal amounts for refills ($20-$30/gal). I'm pretty sure, though, that hydration is preferable over expense...
Quote from: Okach on June 04, 2010, 04:50:30 PM
Thanks for the input! I tried to ask as many people as possible immediately after the ball about the music list. We had a roughly 80/15/5 split on like it/like it but could be more traditional/meh. And there were the five or so more people who made DJ requests. Come to think of it, that's about average for all the WCS comps that I've been too. :) When you have 900+ people roaming around the ballroom, it's a forlorn hope to expect everyone to like the music all the time - but the floor was consistently full, so from our perspective as staff it worked.
As for the water situation, we're largely at the mercy of the hotel as to what can be provided to dispense it. And if it's like the other dance events in hotels, FanimeCon got charged unreal amounts for refills ($20-$30/gal). I'm pretty sure, though, that hydration is preferable over expense...
Just to chime in, not every song is going to make everyone happy. We did have a forum thread to ask for requests for music so maybe next year we will have to advertise the thread more.
As for the water, the Fairmont was kind enough to donate all the water for us. I just think they were not aware that there would be over 2000 people coming into to the room that night. But that is something we will address for next year.
Thanks for your comments and suggestions everyone. Keep them coming.
-Jim
I agree with Jim we are not going to make everyone happy with the music list, just make most people happy.
Loved the ball this year. It was the highlight of my weekend.
Favorite things:
It was good to see that they got a bigger ballroom since 2008(didn't go in 2009). The Imperial Ballroom was just spectacular.
The dance floor was nice, i could of danced for another couple of hours.
Thought the music was nice, a lot of variety from traditional to modern(though some songs I heard at my senior prom)
Negative:
The water kept on running out.
Overall I had a wonderful time and I am definitely going back next.
This year's B&W Ball was my first ever, despite it being my 5th or 6th Fanime. It was the best part of my weekend. I loved it! I enjoyed the dance classes. I believed it helped me enjoy the ball more. I love dancing, and with ball room dancing being new to me, the classes were the only thing I looked forward to attending during the day. I thought the choice of music was excellent. The playlist was well compiled. The instructors are amazing! They definitely deserve props! I danced so hard that my legs and feet hurt till the next day, but it was all worth it! The venue was beautiful and well decorated. There was always water at the water tables I went to. That helped a lot! the Demos were also amazing!
I noticed the dress force wasn't too enforced. There were a few very short dresses roaming around. The ladies who plan to wear gowns next year should be warned on how long their dresses could be. I few of the dresses were always getting snagged, stepped on, and ripped at hems. I think the attendance will greatly increase next year; its gonna get more crowded.
I agree with some of the suggestions to let the dancers know doing their stationary dancing to dance in the middle, so the traveling dances can actually travel. I was glad to see the conga line and the break dancing circle broken up. The line dancing should have been encouraged in the middle of the dance floor so they wouldn't get in the way as well.
Overall I give the staff an A++++++ for all their hard work! Thank you! I am already excited for next year's B&W ball. The classes has inspired me to take up ball room dancing classes :)
Re: lighting - We probably could have gotten away with the dimming level we had for the Friday night classes, but for me I liked all the lights up. Lot easier to navigate through the room that way and to be able to interact off the dance floor.
there were at least four or five threads about the ball, where people could ask questions. also, as a general tip for anything related to fanime: there is always someone to email with questions.
congo line: perhaps it could have gone around the outside of the dance floor. my dance partner and i were dancing to our favorite song (amazingly they were playing our favorite song) and it was all magical and fun, and then all of the sudden this congo line comes up and squishes us off the dance floor. and people kept adding to it, so we missed the entire song because the congo line got in the way. so basically, perhaps the congo and thriller and cha cha slide can be done off the floor, and the floor can be reserved for the ball dances.
water: i was confused, but now i understand. $30 per gallon is ridiculous. i'll bring my own water bottle next year, just in case :)
volume: already been adressed. cool.
dress code: i think that people who can't afford dress shoes shouldn't be turned away. if they're really trying, and have the rest of the outfit and a true desire to go to the ball, shoes should be overlooked. however, the girls who hiked up their skirts should have been adressed, no matter how cute their legs are. i saw three of those girls.
adding west coast was wonderful! i loved it. and thanks for the dance, Okach! it was very enjoyable :D
Quote from: michiko nakano on June 05, 2010, 04:27:01 PM
water: i was confused, but now i understand. $30 per gallon is ridiculous. i'll bring my own water bottle next year, just in case :)
Holy cow, did they really spend $30 per gallon for water!!???
Now that's what I call inflation.
Hey Jim! I started a Fanime B&W Ball group on facebook if you don't mind. Here's the link for those people who enjoyed the ball so much and I'm sure we can talk more about it. Everyone who enjoys the ball and has facebook are welcome to join!
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=119458761429317&ref=mf
I agree with the above poster that the Conga line was quite out of place on the dance floor. While doing something like that is all fun and good, it's supposed to be a formal event for a reason.
Though I did love the dance this year. I was Professor Layton...dancing with another Professor Layton! Fanime Madness is great.
I won't bother listing pros and cons of the ball, since I have no basis for comparison with previous years (and all the pros were already listed in this thread)
I do have several ideas to improve the black & white ball though.
1) The dance lessons. I think that fewer lessons but longer lessons would be more beneficial. Attendees show up, get the very basics of a dance, but never get much of a chance to become comfortable/confident with dancing in that way. I think 2hr lesson blocks for a particular dance would give the students much more opportunity to cement the basic dance moves. Give more time to get used to leading or following. Practice navigating the dance floor (very necessary for traveling dances). And of course meet more people.
Furthermore very little instruction time was given towards actually dancing to music. The instructors calling out 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8 for the various steps is so much easier to make out than the beat of the music. Therefore more practice at listening to the music for the dance rhythm rather than simply for enjoyment would be beneficial.
Now, extending the lesson time would require either larger blocks of the day to be allocated to dancing (which of course places demands on the instructors), or cutting the number of dances taught. I believe there could be less redundancy in the lesson schedule and cut some of the harder or less popular dances maybe. I definitely believe it would be better for the students to learn 1 (or 2) dances well, than to have a whole jumble of dance moves getting mixed up by beginners.
2) The Projector. The slide layout needs a lot of work. First of all, the screen was only clearly visible from the dance floor itself. This may have been one of the reasons for people standing around on the dance floor. Trying to read the screen from a 45 (or higher) degree angle is not easy. This was further compounded by the low contrast of some of the text. Blue text on a black background...... bad.... bad. Additionally the text size of everything except the name of the dance was a good deal smaller than it could have been. Again making it difficult to read from a distance.
Specific suggestions on this front.
A) Remove the Black & White banner from the top 50% of the slide. Its pointless..... everyone already knows they are at the B&W ball. It takes up valuable screen real-estate.
B) Change the screen location to off to the side somewhere. Perhaps add 2 projectors 1 for each side of the room. Or hell, put it on the ceiling somehow. If I remember correctly, the room is rectangular, so to maximize view-ability place the screen on the shorter wall.
C) Setup the slide such that it shows the name of the song, and then a list of preferred dances. The upcoming list could be on a separate slide and alternate with the "now playing" slide (say 10 sec interval) OR the entire playlist could be on another (smaller?) screen nearby.
D) Be generous with labeling songs as one type of dance or another. Yes, its been mentioned many times that generally you can dance to anything if you know how. Key word, know how. But, with inexperienced dancers will be more concerned with trying to find something that is labeled a dance they can do rather than improvise. So, as a rule I would label each piece as "preferred dances" and then "secondary dances". List the best fits in the preferred section, and then list everything else in the other section (unless.... it totally, completely absolutely doesn't fit). That way, more people will look at slide, see something that they know how to do, and try for it.
3) The playlist itself. I personally believe a rough schedule of when certain types of songs would be played might help some people plan out their night a bit. If for example someone only learned W.C.S. then it might be nice to have a stretch of songs that could all work with that dance (not exclusively mind you). Often it felt as if things just started getting into a rhythm, and then the song changes to something entirely different. Don't get me wrong, its nice to have variety. But for instance if maybe the first 30 minutes of the ball had all songs that could be Waltzed, and then the last song in that set, would definitely be danceable with Waltz OR {next dance set}. Smooth transition.
4) I think more clearly marked areas for dancers lacking partners might have been beneficial. Similar to how the dance lessons were split with leaders on 1 side, and followers on the other. Perhaps the north side of the room could be designated leaders-looking-for-partners while the south side is followers-looking-for-partners. It would make it easier to figure out who was resting or just chatting with friends as opposed to those who currently wanted to dance. Also it provides an easier avenue for shyer people to be found by ... no so shy people.
As a miscellaneous note (from the other posts). I think the checkpoint for entry into the ball and the corresponding line that forms should be further back down the hallway. Included past the checkpoint should be a bathroom, so that attendees won't have to "leave" the ball to use the facilities.
Was there a "rave" type event held at fanime this year? I think there was in years past, and if one were held concurrently then perhaps it would attract that crowd away from the ball to prevent solo dancers from taking over the floor.
I'll probably think of more later.
Quote from: Okach on May 31, 2010, 09:04:35 PM
The main feedback that I got from talking to people who attended:
...
B) I got blizzarded by DJ requests. I will comment here the same way I replied during the ball: if you have requests, we had the forum thread open for at least four months. We don't take requests at the ball because if every 20th person who went to the ball requested a song, we would have a request list that would be longer than the actual playlist at the ball. I might add that I loved the response I got when I mentioned that - "Well, just pick the good ones." My civil reply was to ask how THAT would be decided.
...
I think, as other posters have mentioned, it would be useful for the dj to compile a set library before the dance that dancers could request online. A "drop box" is a good way to review requests as they come in during the dance for the dj, which could be done through the use of a simple pen and notepad.
Despite the blizzard of of competing requests, it is really up to the
DJ to decide what song to play. While request tools may be very useful in gaining a sense of what the dancers want, ultimately it is the DJ who will play the right songs that is in the interest of the dance as a whole. A caveat: I have not yet been to the BW ball, but as a DJ who has spun for salsa/bachata/cha-cha crowds, I've learned to gear requests for the ladies. The gents will dance to whatever the ladies dance to. You also don't want to play a request that only 1-5 people out of the entire dance can really groove to.
If requests come with a tip, the DJ may want to use an envelope to use as an "escrow." Simply put the tips into the envelope, and if the request gets played, the dj can take the tip. If not, it remains in the envelope.
Just my suggestions for resolving the DJ request issue.
We actually set up the playlist in advance over a month with minor edits heading into Fanime, so that we could als have power point slides that would tell you what kind of dance and the song you are dancing too and also what dances are coming up. So making any changes in the middle would have been close to impossible.
Quote from: GoodAsianDriver on July 03, 2010, 08:16:18 AM
Quote from: Okach on May 31, 2010, 09:04:35 PM
The main feedback that I got from talking to people who attended:
...
B) I got blizzarded by DJ requests. I will comment here the same way I replied during the ball: if you have requests, we had the forum thread open for at least four months. We don't take requests at the ball because if every 20th person who went to the ball requested a song, we would have a request list that would be longer than the actual playlist at the ball. I might add that I loved the response I got when I mentioned that - "Well, just pick the good ones." My civil reply was to ask how THAT would be decided.
...
I think, as other posters have mentioned, it would be useful for the dj to compile a set library before the dance that dancers could request online. A "drop box" is a good way to review requests as they come in during the dance for the dj, which could be done through the use of a simple pen and notepad.
Despite the blizzard of of competing requests, it is really up to the DJ to decide what song to play. While request tools may be very useful in gaining a sense of what the dancers want, ultimately it is the DJ who will play the right songs that is in the interest of the dance as a whole. A caveat: I have not yet been to the BW ball, but as a DJ who has spun for salsa/bachata/cha-cha crowds, I've learned to gear requests for the ladies. The gents will dance to whatever the ladies dance to. You also don't want to play a request that only 1-5 people out of the entire dance can really groove to.
If requests come with a tip, the DJ may want to use an envelope to use as an "escrow." Simply put the tips into the envelope, and if the request gets played, the dj can take the tip. If not, it remains in the envelope.
Just my suggestions for resolving the DJ request issue.
Thank you for your suggestions. We face a couple of problems with the BWBall playlist.
1) The playlist actually coinsides with the powerpoint that we have up that evening. The powerpoint actually states the name of the song, who sang it, where it is from, and the dances that you can do to the song. To honor a request at the BWBall would not permit us to do that before hand and it would not fit into the powerpoint presentation.
2) The length of the song. All the songs that we had this year were edited and cut so that it would fit around 3:30 seconds. This is to accommodate more songs and dances in the BWBall. Some songs that we had were 2 minutes in length when played outright, but most other songs ranged from 4:30 to 8 minutes. The instructors and staff spent a great deal making sure that the music had a steady beat to dance to and that the length of the song was long enough to dance to but not too long where beginners would repeat the same paterns over 20 times during the dance.
3) The songs we had were suggested. Even if we did have suggestions, there is no guarantee that we would have the music that you would like on the hdd or on cd.
We will try to see how we can better address this issue for next year. Thank you everyone for your comments and suggestions. Keep them coming. :)
- Jim
BWBall Head 2010
And for the record, the dance floor was about halfway full to totally full after 10 songs. And it stayed totally full to the end. :P
It would be really neat if we had a competition in the dance like how AX's masquerade ball used to be where we can make ballroom versions of anime characters and enter. I think they had two versions, solo and partner with three skill levels for both. It was always a nice break in the dancing to see everyone who worked hard on their outfits get up in front and show them off where we could really see them (hard looking at someone's outfit while dancing. :) ) Plus it gave the dance a more anime feel.
I was at least two of the AX Masq balls and didn't like the idea. For me it took way too much time (I believe at least an hour) and killed the mood of the room. Granted, I'm sure that a substantial number of people would like the idea but I really wouldn't support it as a main event for the Ball itself. If it got run as a side activity and they allowed the winners to be presented at some point during the Ball...then I might find it palatable.
Quote from: Okach on August 13, 2010, 12:57:27 PM
I was at least two of the AX Masq balls and didn't like the idea. For me it took way too much time (I believe at least an hour) and killed the mood of the room. Granted, I'm sure that a substantial number of people would like the idea but I really wouldn't support it as a main event for the Ball itself. If it got run as a side activity and they allowed the winners to be presented at some point during the Ball...then I might find it palatable.
At first I thought that would be nice for Fanime's B&W Ball. Then I think about it from Okach said that if that I would like to see that happen as side activity and present it at one point at the ball. One of my suggestion of doing that on a side activity would be stage zero. But only problem is who's going to help judge? But I don't like the idea of asking for help from different department such as Masquerade since they have their own thing to do.
I was wondering if this would be offered next year and if so I'm looking for a partner! Ive danced lindy hop for 2 years and west coast for 1 year.
Quote from: PrincessCake on October 09, 2010, 07:06:50 PM
I was wondering if this would be offered next year and if so I'm looking for a partner! Ive danced lindy hop for 2 years and west coast for 1 year.
Were you asking if the Black and White Ball was going to be offered next year or if there was going to be a side activity for next year? The Black and White Ball will be back for 2011. As for the side event, we are taking in suggestions but there is no guarantee that we will make every suggestion come true. So right now we are just brainstorming for ideas.
- Jim
Unfortunately I didn't get to stay at the Ball long enough to take in the full experience. 3 of the 4 boys in our group neglected to listen to my reminders of wearing proper attire and thought that black sneakers with their dress shirts and pants would be good enough ^^;
This year I'm definitely reminding them before we leave for the convention.
Quote from: Rin_chan on January 01, 2011, 03:32:28 PM
Unfortunately I didn't get to stay at the Ball long enough to take in the full experience. 3 of the 4 boys in our group neglected to listen to my reminders of wearing proper attire and thought that black sneakers with their dress shirts and pants would be good enough ^^;
This year I'm definitely reminding them before we leave for the convention.
Let them know that we are very strict with the dress code even towards shoes that we will turn them down. Don't say we didn't warn you guys especially we repeated this rule many time.
Well, the word should hopefully be posted in good time so that there's time for arbitration and such.
Quote from: OniCourseMusha on January 04, 2011, 10:05:54 PM
Quote from: Rin_chan on January 01, 2011, 03:32:28 PM
Unfortunately I didn't get to stay at the Ball long enough to take in the full experience. 3 of the 4 boys in our group neglected to listen to my reminders of wearing proper attire and thought that black sneakers with their dress shirts and pants would be good enough ^^;
This year I'm definitely reminding them before we leave for the convention.
Let them know that we are very strict with the dress code even towards shoes that we will turn them down. Don't say we didn't warn you guys especially we repeated this rule many time.
seriously, i know the rules need to be strictly enforced as it is a black tie kind of event. I made sure to ask in the attire thread that my outfit was good enough before I bought it all. I wish more people would read the threads so they wouldn't be upset when they aren't let inside.